Well known guardinals?

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Clueless's picture
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Webmonkey
Joined: 2008-06-30
Well known guardinals?

In a simular vien to the thread Well known Loths? - are there many named guardinal celestials that we can find in the planescape releases?

Eco-Mono's picture
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Namer
Joined: 2004-05-10
Well known guardinals?

Five jink says this thread won't even be half as long as the 'loth one. Sad

Clueless's picture
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Webmonkey
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Well known guardinals?

A can of soda at Gencon says Rip has a list already. Eye-wink

Gerzel's picture
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factotums
Joined: 2004-05-10
Well known guardinals?

If he doesn't give me enough time. I'm working my way round the wheel. Current project: The Bloodwar.

Though I am not adverse to having someone else working on the same project for other places on the planes and other bloods and cutters and barmies. I just started with the loths and fiends b/c they seem to be some of the most interesting figures.

ripvanwormer's picture
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Factol
Joined: 2004-10-05
Well known guardinals?

'Clueless' wrote:
A can of soda at Gencon says Rip has a list already. Eye-wink

Heh. Actually, I do. It's not exhaustive, but I do have one.

I'll point you toward this site, though, especially.

The one that leaps to my mind immediately, besides the various incarnations of Talisid and the Five Companions, is Mowatt Ke'Mahn, a lupinal war leader mentioned in Hellbound and one of the yugoloth scholars in Faces of Evil.

Tripicus from Uncaged is also a major one.

From Planes of Conflict:

Talisid
Duke Lucan (lupinal)
Duchess Callisto (ursinal)
Duke Windheir (avoral)
Lord Hwhyn (equinal)
Lord Rhanok (cervidal)
Sirian Goodwife (lupinal proxy of Isis)

Gerzel's picture
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factotums
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Well known guardinals?

I'm posting partailly to bump this and to say that I am currently looking through the Bloodwar book taking down the npcs there. There are a couple of guardinals so I'll add those to the well knowns.

xidoraven's picture
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Joined: 2009-10-17
Re: Well known guardinals?

I also began a thread on this same topic with the hopes of forging a full history of the guardinals in order to show where they led congruent and divergent histories to a variant of them (my own homebrew) known as the dinopriminals.

That thread is here: /forum/guardinals-beastlands-and-other-outsiders

Rip included quite a few homebrew historical concepts for them from many other sources, and I hope to help create a finalized historical account that places both the guardinals and the dinopriminals in a very specific cosmological niche for each. Though they had similar beginnings, they took very different paths, and in fact even separated into different planes because of the differing perspectives on their place and purposes in the cosmos.

I think the major challenge is showing how the universe's original Law v. Chaos opposition turned into the situation we now see in PS, which is primarily a Lawful Evil v. Chaotic Evil (baatezu/tanar'ri blood war), and a Good v. Evil (celestials/fiends) polarity in many cases. The evolution of the outsider races from chaos/law axes to the current setup is a tough transition to create and rationalize all at once, but I do not believe it is impossible.

Should this discussion of the guardinals' early history be placed here, or on the other thread I have created, or should I simply make a new one? In any case, I will likely delve at least a little bit into the homebrew concepts of the early evolution of the outsiders that Rip shared on my own thread, and try to enhance it in such a way that is both parallel to PS canon, as well as beneficial to the basis of my concept in working with the new dinopriminal races.

Is there any specific history on how the above mentioned guardinal paragons (lord, duchesses, dukes, princes, etc.) were replaced by the paragons (Talisid & companions) featured in 'Book of Exalted Deeds'? I noticed some notes about how a few of the Companions are recent additions to the group, and that lines up with these differing names listed above (likely from an earlier published resource)...

I would like to have a rough concept of the history lined up before the middle of next month, so that I can keep up on my projects regarding the dinopriminals and their culture, history, and purpose.

The primary concept that I am working with is that at some point in the very distant past, guardinals took a more compassionate and protective view of mortal humanoids which had no major connection to animals and nature, whereas dinopriminals were more concerned with animals, nature, ecology, and monstrous humanoids that had direct and specific interests and involvement in these aspects of life - excluding all humanoids not directly vested in aspects of their protection over nature and wildlife.

During a time when a diverse group of celestials were making divine pacts to create areas of protected Prime worlds, the dinopriminals chose and were directed to the be the caretakers and shepherds of the Prime world known as Nym, and were beseeched to continue upholding direct ties to the Beastlands and its divinities (deific powers overseeing nature and wildlife). Great pacts were manifested in the form of powerful divine sigils imbued with powers of the deities to watch over and protect Nym as a preserve-world which would continue the work of the Wyld in the Prime reality. These sigils still exist today, protecting the planet of Nym from major interplanar calamity and even the eventual destruction of the surrounding Prime worlds during a cataclysmic event known as the Epicene (Jashnian Cosmology, 3e). Nym exists as a Prime world with the Divinely Morphic trait, because it is tended by divine beings and their exemplars and patrons. Exemplars of these divinities would be the Dinopriminal races, while the major patrons of these divinities would be the Faunar (a shapeshifting catfolk race and secret subcultural power center) and other monstrous humanoid races with obvious bestial traits - primarily natives of the Prime world, Nym.

Aside from those ideas, everything else is up in the air on the guardinal's history, but I would like to fill in all the blanks as soon as it is feasible. Eye-wink Rip, you know how much I value your insights, so I will definitely listen to any input you have. I know we covered some of this in the other thread, so there is no need to repeat - we can just copy-paste the major themes wherever this discussion ends up; here, there, or elsewhere.
-will

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