The soul of Planescape will remain very much alive in 4E!!!

I'm not all that excited. It's only going to be a paragraph in the DMG. Anything else they publish on Sigil will be in books on the new cosmology, which I'm not using. And I can get all the info on Sigil I need right here.

What I find of more interest is that she said the soul of Planescape will live on. And that's the important part.

I've realised (eventually) that Planescape isn't the City of Doors, or the Blood War, or the factions or the Wheel. It's about the attitude and philosophies of the setting. All the other stuff is window dressing, natural consequences of applying the Planescape way to the Great Wheel cosmology. We've all gotten very attached to the specifics of the setting, when what really makes it PS for us is the spirit of the thing. So I think 4E Planescape will work out just fine. I'll just be different than 3E Planescape.

I'm thinking of integrating some stuff into my campaign, but the guideline for me is, make it fit the Great Wheel, not the Great Wheel fit it. So I'm making the Feywild a demiplane among other thing. So if there's something cool in the new cosmology we can filch it, but otherwise we ignore it.

Speaking of which, are they preserving the alignment system?

Seconded. There's no more reason not to use anything than there is to use everything.

Sure not. You can still summon them for 6 rounds. But after that they vanish, because you don't need them.

But if you're only having friendly encounters with them, there's no reason for them to have combat stats, in WotC's thinking.

Well, instead of using the great wheel, the cosmology consists of:

The World, not even the Prime or just Material anymore.

The Shadowfell, pretty much the plane of shadow.

Feywild, the plane of fairies.

The Astral Sea, a big mish-mash of deific realms.

The Elemental Chaos, pretty much Limbo, the Abyss, and the inner planes all thrown together in a blender.

And the Far Realm.

Yup. That's it.

'Squaff' wrote:

They call "that" a cosmology. :shock: :roll: I dont know should I laugh or should I cry. :cry:

It is obwious that they are simplifing D&D for little kiddies, and new genaration of gamers have start from somwhere (even if the basic setting is bit of, well "basic").

When I was a little kiddie, I had no problem with the concept of the Outer Planes. Kids these days...

Eh, I don't know. We'll probably get some good new locations from the deal. Many of their sites should work ok dropped into one of the Planes, or as Demiplanes in the Ethereal.

I guess that D&D is regressing in its original form: You go around, kill EVIL monsters (is there any other kind?), get XP and treasure, hang arond with friends for mindless fun and laughs.
That I can get by playing WoW, thank you wery much. :x

Prehaps this thread should be renamed in "Soulshell of Planescape will reamain alive in 4e (but not that much)"?

It's my latest adventure hook:

A cult of evil wizards is rewriting the very fabric of reality, and a number of people arn't pleased. This cult is destroying, merging, and rewriting entire planes of existance, and they are not doing a very good job.

Their crimes include nearly destroying half of the lower planes (the demons are NOT HAPPY that their home has been mixed with the inner planes), doing god-knows-what to the Prime worlds (the gods are getting very very worried), and turning every single celestial warrior into a stat-less NPC pansy (luckily, the demons are too busy dealing with the fact that their home is being turned inside out to take advantage of the oppertunity).

Monsters of all races and allignments are fleeing to Sigil, although some people worry that even the City of Doors will face a similar fate. Even some gods are stashing away their divinity and hiding out in Sigil. As a result, tempers are high in the City of Doors as everybody wonders what the future will hold.

Adventurers needed to stop this insane cult of wizards before they destroy the soul of the planes.

Are you up to the challenge?

I want Spelljammer back.

Seriously, how can you possibly go wrong with mind flayers in space?

Why not? They've pretty much dropped the first alignment axis in favor of PC vs Not-PC.

I don't think they've ever shown us anything that is tagged as Lawful or Chaotic, and infact they dance around without using those terms for Demons and Devils, even though Demons are clearly Chaotic and Devils are clearly Lawful.

On the other hand, I believe that someone mentioned 9 alignment roles for Paladins (which included the old paladin plus Blackguard). That was a LONG time ago, though, so the second axis might have been dropped between then and now.

Umm...4e needs more 2e.

I still think the 2e Illithiad is the best D&D rulebook ever produced. Chock full of awesome!

Sure, and while we're at it why don't we make elves and dwarves into classes again?

It seems even RPGs are becoming more and more moronic along with the rest of the damn world!

Pah Rpgs used ta be good! Now look at em! Not even the front runners of basic table top rpgs have have the imaginary spark to conjure up a world beyond "good" guys vs "evil" guys.

Why I remember my days of playing paranoia not a single fight did we ever play, the whole game was brilliant because our team was a total failure, thanks to the ingenious inventive imagination of a brilliant GM.

First EA makes my boil, but WOTC makes it turn black!

Sure Planescapes alive and kicken, the same why the warped clone of Ripleys was in Alien:Ressurrection. Dammit nuts to fucking WOTSC Planescapes is ours!!

Sure, and while we're at it why don't we make elves and dwarves into classes again?

It seems even RPGs are becoming more and more moronic along with the rest of the damn world!

Pah Rpgs used ta be good! Now look at em! Not even the front runners of basic table top rpgs have have the imaginary spark to conjure up a world beyond "good" guys vs "evil" guys.

Why I remember my days of playing paranoia not a single fight did we ever play, the whole game was brilliant because our team was a total failure, thanks to the ingenious inventive imagination of a brilliant GM.

First EA makes my blood boil, but WOTC makes it turn black!

Sure Planescapes alive and kicken, the same why the warped clone of Ripleys was in Alien:Ressurrection. Dammit nuts to fucking WOTC Planescapes is ours!!

Well, if we want to see the crunch, they've put the 4e pit fiend up on the main site.

It looks interesting.

Sorry clueless I shall refrain from using my more gutteral style of english from now. Also sorry for the triple post. Bad internets! No dessert for you!

I shall now swear in Drow. Vith dos WOTC dos rothe iblith!

After all of the comments and ideas posted on 4E, I've decided to pass on it. It seems to be aimed at the Everquest/Warcraft crowd, rather than the veteran gamer. I find WotC's decision to abandon many long-standing components of the D&D mythology and culture quite irritating.

I remain skeptical about whether people who play MMORPGs would be interested in tabletop RPGs. The crossover market is probably smaller than they expect.

I am reminded of the time when TSR decided to start publishing the "Basic D&D" line as a parallel to AD&D - the Basic. Expert, Companion, and Masters sets sound a lot like what 4E promises. The fact that all of the gamers I play with, and a significant fraction of the D&D players online, are already planning on avoiding 4E enhances this impression.

Hey!, All this tale remembers me of the old days when 2ed was the last edition published, please forgive my chant as english is my last known language (ands thats something since i speake modron since 9, not that i am a very lawfull person, but a blood has to known its enemies speach, not that i am a blood... well you know what i mean).

Any way, when ad&d was played and 3rd edition D&D came out, i said and heard all this stuff, people laughing about the new rules and people who liked since the begining, i myself tryied to stay away from 3rd since three years ago, i thought i could survive with the new system, i buyed lots of books, and i kept saying myself i didnt need planescape setting, fact is that isnt true, see... planes have all this magic around, once you have seen some tales, bloods, and of course some berks, you can't go back to the prime material world, of the books i said i buyed i include some forgotten realms material, well i tried to stay at faerun, but there is no room there for a philosophic adventurer like me, the whole spirit of the setting was somehow void, i read from someone, that he is moving to 4e and not using his planescape material, well thats impossible, once you have fought the blood war, seen how the lady kicks out the factions out of sigil, known the secrets of the maeldur, and the power of the ship of chaos (well, there are a lots of things out there too... you can visit some friend of mine lost in the harmonica down there in pandemonium if you want more chant), rescuing the realm of cormyr or dealing with the red thai wizards seems like a weekend or holyday, no... there is no room for the planewalkers in a setting with no sigil AND beyond... that was inspired...