Shimring and the Lady of Pain

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twiggyleaf's picture
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Shimring and the Lady of Pain

I have developed a D&D 3.5 campaign on Obsidian Portal - Shimring - Faces of Divinity - which I am currently running, and although most of it takes place outside of Sigil, I have used Sigil as the springboard for the Campaign. In designing this campaign I have used The Lady of Pain (through control of the only Portals between the Shimring and The City of Doors) in a certain way, considering her as a special deity. I would be interested to know how others on this site (who have no doubt endlessly discussed such things) view Her, and if my concept in any way supports or contradicts other theories.

Concept of Shimring
Shimring is a mystical realm run by the Droomalith (an uber-deity powered by the dreams of sentient beings) as a Questing Ground to restore major inbalances in the Universe. In my campaign concept it was the Droomalith who united the new Gods against the Primordial Powers of Tharizdun/Cthulhu in the very beginning when Shimring was the power base of all life.

The quests set by the Droomalith occur in the Ancient Temples of Primordial Power, and by use of the most powerful artifact in the multiverse, The Heart of the Dracolich, the Questors are able to coexist in two planes at the same time in order to complete their quests, which take place within these ancient temples, still latent with malevolent Chaotic energy.

Role of the Lady of Pain
The Lady of Pain, with her unique placement in the multiverse, has the power to awaken the Droomalith and open a Portal to Wyrmland - the only point in the world of Droomalithia that can be accessed through other planes without the Heart of the Dracolich. She creates the portal, which is then continually guarded by the Guardians of the Gates while the Quest takes place. The quest always has universal consequences. The quests take place simultaneously on the Island of Shimring and the coexistent plane with which it is joined.

As such, my campaign relies on the Lady of Pain being a very special Deity and I wondered if some others on this site see Her in any similar way.

All comments welcome,
twiggyleaf

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

I use the Lady in a very different way; but as I don't think my interpretation would be of much use to you, I'd rather hammer out your vision of Her and then add any ideas this sparks.

Since she controls the passage of beings that restore "imbalances" in the multiverse, she seems to effectively control (along with your Droomalith) which items in the multiverse get corrected.
So do see the Lady as an ultimate "druidic" (for lack of a better word) deity that instead of focusing on forests and such, focuses on the natural "balanced" growth of the multiverse?
Is this balance determined as the current status quo or is it based on the subconscious collective dreams of the sentient beings of the multiverse?

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

Hi Palomides
I suppose when I envisaged the concept I saw the Lady primarily as "gatekeeper" but in terms of "alignment" I have always seen her as "neutral". The Droomalith in my campaign is definitely "neutral" and is concerned with the balance of such forces throughout the multiverse but, like any "neutral" character, would I suppose, err on the side of Lawful over Chaos.

So, yes, in her role as Shimring Gatekeeper, I do see the Lady as concerned with the natural balanced growth of the universe, but in her duty of awakening the Droomalith, would only act on major shifts and inbalances that she is able to determine from being at the hub of the alignment wheel.

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

I was about to write a bunch of follow-up questions but I guess I should start with the highest level concept.

I briefly went to your link (on another post) but there was too much info there for me to easily process. So I'll just base my question on what you wrote above:

"Shimring is a mystical realm...as a Questing Ground to restore major inbalances in the Universe"

So is Shimring the launching point of the forces that go out and re-balance the universe, or it a "battlefield" where conflicts are determined, the results of which then go out and influence the universe?
I initially interpreted it as a launching point of agents sent to balance things. But from the quote above, I get the impression that you might mean Shimring itself as the place where conflicts happen

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

Palomides,
Shimring is (if you like) the "testing ground" for the chosen. (It has a history, being the origin of all sentient beings before it became a physical landmass, but that does not really impact on the fact that it is now mainly a testing ground).

Various deities are involved in certain schemes controlled by the Droomalith, the outcomes of which are determined by the chosen Questors, (who if you like are ambassadors of the deities involved). So, the outcomes of major events are determined by the Characters, who are in Shimring but are simultaneously on another plane as well.

The things happening in the wider world will be happening anyway, but you can view the actions of the characters as being an injection of influence into the events.
(e.g. my Questors' first influence is to meet with Iuz, and use the Heart of the Dracolich to force a truthful answer to their question, which will lead them to their next quest. They do this in Greyhawk - adapting "Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk" and by use of the artifact, trigger Zagyg's Godtrap, thus trapping Iuz and preventing the destruction of Greyhawk, although this is not the primary quest of the characters involved. They continue to the next temple and a new coexistent plane.)

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Gandalf the Grey

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

I guess I'm still a little vague on how the Questors co-exist (or co-afffect) both Shimring and the rest of the universe, but I'll let that be for the moment.

So you have said that the Lady of Pain can "awaken the Droomalith and open a Portal to [his co-existent plane]. So does this imply that the Lady is the one who makes the decision that a "correction" is needed and then prods Droomalith awake enough to set up the test on this co-existent plane?
If this is true, I could see how the Lady earned the moniker "of Pain" as she would be responcible for a lot of difficult trails for the Questors and would cause a lot of rising movements to painfully shut down (e.g. if the devils started to win the Blood War, some test in Shimring might cause a painful loss of momentum to their cause - setting things back to the status quo)

I guess the next big question concerns "agenda". Do you see Droomalith (and/or the Lady of Pain) just trying to maintain the planar status quo (e.g. keeping the Blood War balanced) or do you see one or both of them working to some other subtle goal to "improve" the multiverse in some way that doesn't conform to traditional good vs. evil, law vs. chaos, etc.?

In the same vein, do Droomalith and the Lady have the same agenda?
I could easily see a situation where one (let's say the Lady) is actively trying to prod the more dormant one (Droomalith, in this case) into action but not completely getting the results She wanted.
Following this hypothetical set-up (which I realize may not be what you had in mind), you could depict the Lady as a being trying to re-shape the cosmos but continually frustrated (hence her surly attitude) because the being with the power to actually make the change (Droomalith) only responds grudgingly and never in the desired way. (An analogy of a weak farmer -the Lady - trying to prod her powerful, but sluggish and obstinate ox into doing work)

Another alternative is that Droomalith is the "wild dreamer" who would change the underpinings of the universe with each passing whim if his influence wasn't limited and somewhat controlled by the access the Lady allows him (and the Questors) to interact with the rest of the universe

Are any of these possibilities sparking any ideas for you?

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

and by use of the most powerful artifact in the multiverse, The Heart of the Dracolich,
Oh, come on, the Multiverse's most powerful artifact is merely associated with a dracolich? You'd think it would be something resulting from a joint project of several greater deities. I mean look at the Rod of 7 Parts... or the artifact in my timeline created by a joint effort of Akadi, Istishia, Olhydra, Ben Hadar, Cryonax, Chan, and Yan-C-Bin, which tilted the balance of the elements from a severe earth and fire dominance to a water and air dominance. (avctually to be more specific, it was an orb of eternal ice created by Istishia. The other quasipowers merely confiscated it and honed it further before Akadi could get her hands on it, as Istishia's intent was for it to be delivered to her for further honing and use. It was infused with so much power that the object became unstable, and it shattered after its first use. Cryonax is trying to collect the fragments of that thing, BTW.)
Those, my friend, are artifacts, and I wouldn't even consider either one to be the most powerful in the Multiverse (though both the rod and the orb certainly rank up there.)

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

Palomides
Lots of good ideas there and some bringing to bear things I had not determined absolutely. I appreciate your thoughts and will try to add to them.
The Droomalith would be concerned with keeping the status quo generally but in cases where universal disaster threatened (such as the freedom of Tharizdun) he would be concerned with "improvement" of the situation.
In terms of game mechanics, mainly he exists to provide a testing ground for players, but these quests will always have Divine effects on various planes, shifting balance between law and chaos, good and evil - this would usually be ubiquitous but in reality just be tweeking in most circumstances.
I had thought the Lady and the Droomalith should have the same agenda. My view of the Lady is that her main role is the more or less peaceful maintenance of Sigil, but since Sigil is also part of the multiverse, she would have an interest in allowing the Droomalith to constantly tweek the multiverse in restoring balances.
I guess I see the Lady as "knowing the mind" of the Droomalith and determining (as he would) when to open the portal to alllow Divine Questors entry into Shimring. I do not envisage them as competing against each other.
I like your idea of the Lady being more or less a Limiting aspect on the "wild dreamer" aspect of the Droomalith. I hadn't thought about their relationship in this way, but it certainly could work I think.
Thanks.

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

Hyena of Ice
I must admit I DID laugh at my own statement when I read your post. (It does sound a bit "my dad is bigger than yours") However, I should point out that the Dracolich in my campaign is not the Standard D&D Dracolich. It is the dead remains of the first great dragon essence, whose bones were used to create the world in which Shimring exists and give it physical form. It has the heart ripped out of it, which disables it and the Questors will always be using the Heart (in the form of a Large Ruby), bringing it ever closer to the Isle of Horus, when it is placed in a certain place, its essence is enabled. At that time it always attempts to break free from Shimring to destroy the Multiverse and at this time only the Droomalith (fully awakened) can stop it. If all goes well, the Droomalith wins, the Dracolich is disabled and the Heart is placed back in Wyrmland ready for the next quest.

I am not negating the power of your artifact, but the reason (in my campaign) that the Heart of the Dracolich is so powerful is that it enables the travel through coexistent planes and has effect over any Deity by use of a Primordial Power Word. The Questors in Shimring travel through the Three Primordial Temples but are also simultaneously travelling through the plane they designate as they enter the temple. The major power of the Heart is not the various spell-like powers that it grants to its wielders - but the fact that it creates plane coexistence and can have influence over any Deity.

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"There are older and fouler things than orcs in the dark places of the world."
Gandalf the Grey

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Re: Shimring and the Lady of Pain

Ah, I see. By its name, it sounds simply like a very powerful (but not deity-level) dracolich's heart.

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