Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

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Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

Hi,

While picturing a planar society of the planes, of places relatively civilised (such as gate towns of the Outlands), it's been increasingly difficult for me to fit all types of people in them - especially petitioners.

If I understand correctly: for an observer, there's really no difference between petitioners and planars. Subtle differences come out after conversation, when their devotion and fixation on the topic of becoming one with the plane is evident. It's stated also, that petitioners are commoners - blacksmiths, peasants, shopkeepers etc. (I mean those not bound to a realm of a particular power). They're also not really aware of the fact, that they are dead. However, they can't have children. So... this makes no sense to me. They might as well have no need to eat or drink.

I'm curious, how did you build your planar societies? They're after all - supposed to be the majority of population on the planes. However, perhaps this doesn't have to relate to "planar" places such as gate towns and neutral areas.

The more I try to design following official material, the more questions arise on the way.

ripvanwormer's picture
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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

They're perfectly aware they're dead, in most cases, although some may be in denial. Many of them remember fragments of their former lives, though usually not their former names or any great details (unless they're granted their memories by a patron power; Dispater is known to grant living memories to the souls he torments in order to increase their suffering).

Most petitioners will have a distinctive look determined by the god or plane. Pandemonic petitioners become hairless, clawed, and wind-resistant, able to grip the rocky surfaces of the plane. Abyssal petitioners become manes, and Baatorian petitioners become lemures. Beastlands petitioners are talking animals.

As outsiders, they don't have to eat or drink, though I like to imagine they "feed" on the power of their deity or the philosophy associated with their plane, so Outlands petitioners would gain sustenance by resolving extremes, and Elysian petitioners would

I've presented Outlandish petitioners as being strangely emotionless and distant, keeping to themselves, with weird glowing eyes. I try to play up the creepiness - they're dead, and no longer remotely human, although if they were human in life they're still humanlike in basic appearance. Their mortal passions are gone, and the passions of the plane itself have replaced them. They may certainly act as blacksmiths or day-laborers or whatever else, but they should be easy to distinguish from living characters with the same careers.

In official presentations, petitioners seem to very much represent a lower class in planar society, ubiquitous servitors who dedicate themselves to advancing the philosophy or power who they hope one day to merge with. In most cases (there are certainly exceptions) they have little individual personality or ego remaining, or they deliberately attempt to suppress it. They may be helpful or baneful, depending on their nature (Outlands petitioners are particularly unpredictable). In many cases they will be deferential to living visitors, hoping to prove by patient service their merit. In others they may be xenophobic and vicious, believing aliens have no place in their realm.

Jem
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Factor
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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

(The adjective for 'from the Outlands' being 'Outlandish' tickles me.)

One thing I like to play up is that the petitioners are the majority. You, the living beings, are the immigrants here, the interlopers. The Outer Planes aren't supposed to be where life happens. In Baator, you mortals are uppity chattel out of your Prime Material ghetto; in the Waste, you're a crawling infection; in Pandemonium, you're the crazy lost wanderers. Even in the Upper Planes, you're pretty presumptuous for being here, though they're a lot nicer about it and often assume you have a good reason for coming.

Of course, the planars stick together, and you don't hear this from your own kind. One reason they stick together. Native outsiders, like couatls, also get a pass, and can work well as intermediaries between the groups.

Oh, and one last thing you get from exemplars or petitioners. A common, unsettling undercurrent of implication. If you're not a petitioner, well, that's just a temporary condition, isn't it, and eventually you will be, and you'd like it to be here, right?

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factotums
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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

""Pandemonic petitioners become hairless, clawed, and wind-resistant, able to grip the rocky surfaces of the plane.""
Aka windscythes from one of the 3.5 monster manuals. (3 or 4 I think)
The natives will likely view the average mortal as being as lowly as the greenest of petitioners (the newest arrivals, that is). They're incredibly impure.
The overlying theme in regards to petitioners and merging either with their patron deity, with the plane itself, or the artificial transformation processes into a fiend used by the Baatezu and Tanar'ri, is that the souls need to 'ripen' before they can be absorbed. In the case of Abyss and Baator petitioners, the canonical sources are quite clear that the torture process is meant to enhance the favored alignment attributes while purging the petitioner of unwanted alignment bits.
Obviously, even the fiends and celestials are not 100% pure representations of their plane's alignment, but even the lowliest/weakest forms of said beings are pretty damn close, compared to mortals.
Presumably, the process of merging for petitioners on the other planes involves a similar process of enhancing the desired alignment traits while slowly casting off the unwanted ones.
Inner Planes alludes (or at least that's the impression I got) that Ogremoch gains some quasi-divine power from the souls of challengers who have been 'imprisoned' in the walls of his dominion. This probably works similarly to sentient-creature sacrifice.
That and the absorption of the souls of thralls/elemental devotees/etc. is probably the only way (short of defeating and absorbing the powers of one or more quasi-deities or slaying an actual deity) that quasi-powers can acquire divine energy.
In the case of the former (sacrifice and Ogremoch's case) however, the benefits probably aren't as good, since the souls are never given time to 'ripen'.

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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

Hyena of Ice wrote:
""Pandemonic petitioners become hairless, clawed, and wind-resistant, able to grip the rocky surfaces of the plane."" Aka windscythes from one of the 3.5 monster manuals. (3 or 4 I think)

Not windscythes; those are monstrous flying creatures that are native to Pandemonium. Pandemonium petitioners still look like people, just people with claws to grab the rock, and the ability to see in pitch blackness.

Though thinking on it, I suppose you could say that windscythes are Pandemonium petitioners in your game. It'd certainly be a neat direction. But I just mean that that's not said to be the case in the material, that'd be house fluff.

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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

Actually, from what I recall, they're a race created by...
Hold on.. *looks up Pandaemonic powers*
Screw this...
*Looks up monster stats*
Created by Erythnul or Talos (depending on what setting you use, but Erythnul by default), so they probably are created from petitioners.

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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

Thanks for anwers!

I was planning to go in the direction of more "ambience" and introduce petitioners to my players as beings more symbolic and overdrawn than what's implied in the books. I have complete box-set for the second edition and I returned to it after a couple of years, and what's in there seems more inconsistent and difficult to implement the more I think about it.

One thing is clear - petitioners are a majority, planars/primes - shouldn't really be there. They're after all - invaders in the world of the dead (I mean the outer planes). Yet, they managed to build societies and mingle with spirits.

In the books it's said that petitioners are commoners, they handle most day-to-day tasks (just like honest peasants and townsfolk in prime campaigns), but perhaps it shouldn't be so. Perhaps they should be creepy figures in back alleys of towns, or meditating hermits in the woods.

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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

Hyena of Ice wrote:
Actually, from what I recall, they're a race created by... Hold on.. *looks up Pandaemonic powers* Screw this... *Looks up monster stats* Created by Erythnul or Talos (depending on what setting you use, but Erythnul by default), so they probably are created from petitioners.

Oh, that's a good point, I forgot about that aspect of them. Yeah, that makes sense.

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Re: Planar societies: petitioners, planars and primes

In the books it's said that petitioners are commoners, they handle most day-to-day tasks (just like honest peasants and townsfolk in prime campaigns), but perhaps it shouldn't be so. Perhaps they should be creepy figures in back alleys of towns, or meditating hermits in the woods.

I think the "creepy figures" thing actually does apply to petitioners of Carceri.

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