Ortho: The Beginnings

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Clueless's picture
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Ortho: The Beginnings

Ok. We have a map selected for Ortho now: (Find that here)

Next - let's get some information on the background and tone of the world.

What we *know*:

The Harmonium was founded by a set of lawful adventureres who managed to exact law in their localized area, saw how good it was for the people there and decided to apply it across the world entirely. In the course of this they eliminated certain groups that were too naturally rebellious to follow the lead of the Harmonium. Hence there are no elves, fey, or halflings - and you can assume that some sizable sections of the human species are gone too. The Harmonium strongly discourages questions regarding these events. They branched out to the Abyss in an ill fated attempt to destroy the root of the 'badness' that kept popping up in their world from time to time, and failing that decided to go to Sigil to work on the problem from that end of things.

What we don't know:

1) Who the adventurers were? It can be assumed that they are dead by now, so stats are not needed - but descriptions, personalities, where on the map they are from and what range of lawful they were...

2) How is the world government laid out? What was the first kingdom they made, where is it?

3) What is the tone of a ultimately lawful society?

Now - the thing to remember is that the Harmonium has its share of LE in addition to LN and LG people. So I can see anything from benevolent 'everyone thinks alike' utopias to truly cruel 'everyone thinks alike or they die' dystopias. The Harmonium does not accept being questioned, there is no outlet for grievances with the Harmonium, save with the Harmonium.

The range of abuse this leads to is going to vary widely across the world. And is probably a serious sticking point between some branches of the Harmonium that rule the place. Think of the lyrics to Imagine interpreted in both the best and the worst possible ways and you may get a feel for the range of flavors here.

The Harmonium is *the* way to rule in this world - so I would also expect democracy and individualism to be some pretty dead/outlawed concepts. I would also expect the better ruled areas to be fairly progressive in terms of technology (Rip mentioned Victorian-esque steam punk?), and the worst ones to amount to a Soviet era level of paranoia and information control.

These three things are the things I would like to get most worked out in this particular part of the thread. Lets get some structure to build all the rest of our people, world and groups off of.

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factotums
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Ortho: The Beginnings

Alright. Let's start with a sort of "Early History of Ortho" the era during which those first heroes of Law first arose.

How about we have them be from the middle continent, the one that stretches from the ecautor to the north pole slightly to the right of center. The Southern portion would be a great place for a country.

Now, who were these heroes? This has ot have been hundreds of years ago....

An adventuring group composed of a Wizard, a Monk, a Druid, and a Paladin?

Hrm.... I'll think on it, I will.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

I stuck them on the northeastern continent, personally. It fit better with my history.

So I assembled Pre-Harmonium Ortho like this:

It's still a work in progress, of course.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

The Flamedance Mountains are the home of the beholders. Motmurk is the home of the orcs. The Empire of Iathra was the dominion of a demon prince the Knights of Harmony ultimately banished.

Heka is a harsh, savage country that trades more with the western continent than the eastern, though it also trades with Voll across the sea.

Voll is a traditional medieval fantasy nation, the homeland of at least one of our heroes.

The Empire of Pan Thaera is an evil place that worships Chaos.

Three-Rivers in the central continent is a biggest city in that land.

Han the Gem-Studded is an exotic port city that specializes in spices and silk, along with the rest of that continent's produce.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

I'm not trying to dominate this project, mind you. If you guys have better names and suggestions, I'm happy to bow to your opinions.

Wizard, a Monk, a Druid, and Paladin work great. All of them would have specific views on what "harmony" is, which might conflict in different areas. These conflicts would carry on to the Harmonium in the present day.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

I was envisioning a lot of these names and nations as places that got assimilated in the end into a world order of some sort. The Harmonium uses this place as a base and as a shining example from what I understand - so they're bound to have their fingers into every kingdom and government to be able to claim dominance over the whole place. The biggest question in my mind is - how do they go about that? Is it something like a UN where there's a representitive from every major land mass/kingdom? Or do they pull more of the way the Catholic Church does - where they have people all over the place who give 'advice' and as it so happenes - everyone follows it?

I really like having the reminients of 'evil' having made their way to that far strip of land there actually. It makes for a *very* convienent setup for a location that I'd been thinking of off the coast. Especially if the legends handed down say that that place was "evil" when the truth of the matter is more along the lines of desperate freedom seekers doomed to destruction.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

If there is a variation on alignment on the good-evil scale, which would lead to some needed method of dealing with moral alignment differences in societies and even in individuals. Perhaps an overarching bureaucratic structure might help. Perhaps something along the lines of sociologist Max Weber's ideal traits of a bureaucracy. Here’s a few ideas:

1. The government proceeds in an orderly and regular manner governed by paperwork. Any grievances with government activity must be submitted formally through the proper channels. Requests and complaints must be filled out in triplicate and take time to be processed. Issues thought to be of highest order by the hierarchy gets processed first.

2. A high degree of specializations. This develops as the citizens learn to cooperate and depend upon each other as a universal order is enforced. Professionals of various specializations exist in a bureaucracy. There might be various overarching boards and committees to handle conflict. One might be a Morals and Values committee for good vs. evil issues.

3. Objectivity and depersonalization of exchange. Emotional exchange and display are discouraged, for they break down and complicate the regular and harmonious nature of bureaucratic exchange that is done through regulated, objective official channels. Consequently, you might see a deadening of individual emotions and outbursts to run in line with collective mental states. The rules that exist exist for everyone regardless of personal traits.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

Hmmm the monk and Paladin had to be lawful, so they would definatly be celebrated by the Harmonium. The Wizard probably had some Arcane order named after him after he died, maybe a rank of magic users that seek to use magic to help expand/enforce the harmonium way?

The one in the group that makes me wonder is the druid... But I like the idea of one of the Harmoniums basic founders being at odds with the Way the Harmonium now exists. It stands to reason that they wouldnt mention the druid alot. He/she's there, but no one really knows too much about him/her.

Another idea that catches my fancy. the Harmonium dont seem to handle change vary well, so how do they handle new events, new ideas, new conflicts? This could range from a strange case brought to a Harmonium officer, or a sudden polical issue with extraplaner cultures. The descisim being based on the whim of the Harmonium present seems too chaotic overall, but the idea of a leading council doesnt seem to fit. Such a situation of supposedly equal individuals, when in reality only a few are holding any cards at all, could lead to a confusion in the chain of command. Who's order do I follow? What adgenda are the Harmonoim advancing? I dont see the Harmonium standing for this.

I see the basis of Harmonium descision making being based on a text. Either writtin by (or supposedly written by) one (or more) of the original adventurers, or as book containing fable-like stories that involve the acts and adventures of the founders. Either way, this book is considered the definitive example of the Harmonium way.

There could even be slightly differant examples in the book of serving the harmonium, based on the original adventures.
Those that choose to follow the Paladin seek to work for the people to promote the greater good and uphold the law, the greater good and the law both being the same thing, which is whatever the Harmonium say it is. This would also explain why the Harmonium attacked the Abyss so often, when the paladin focused harmonium were in power.
Those who followed the Monk sought to achive harmony of the self. Maybe these monks became the order that now interprets the books, supposedly trying to interpret with a clear mind. I don't know...
The wizard order? see above.
As for the druids? Harmony with nature, perhaps? I cant see this being a very influencial dgroup, what with the genocides and all. Genocide would definatly tick off an order trying to keep the balance of nature.

But thats just me.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

By the way, how did was it decided on what happened to the chaotic elements? Were they victims of genocide? Forced off the world to other planes? Put in internment camps?

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Ortho: The Beginnings

I got dragged here from the Livejournal Planescape community specifically for this thread here, read up on what's been said so far, and have some ideas, here goes...

Ancient history is probably a good place to start, but this is burning in my head right now, I need to get it out.

Conflict on the world of Harmony;

Balance, that word has been the defining idea of D&D since Mordenkainen founded his Circle if Eight on Oerth.

The very same thing -did- happen on Krynn three centuries or so in the world's past, with good triumphing over evil, and the result was a cataclysm that nearly destroyed the world. Alternate timelines on Krynn include one where the Kingpriest was victorious, combined all three moons into a giant all-seeing eye which he used to watch and control the whole world with an Orwellian "Big Brother." It happened again, when Raistlin defeated Takhisis, and made war on the gods of goodness with no regards for the balance, evil won out over good, and all life on the planet was killed.

on Athas, Rajaat and the Champions overturned the balance of power, waged wars of genocide and subjugation, and the result was a blasted, dying world.

Every healthy AD&D world has balance as the driving force behind it, and in Planescape it's doubly so. We've seen what happens when the balance isn't maintained, we know why the Rilmani (among others) are so insistant about it, worlds fall to pieces when the balance isn't maintained.

So why is Ortho so perfect?

It's not, it can't be.

Areas of Ortho where genocide took place might be cordoned off so the mass graves are never seen, or it might be for the safety of the public... Necropolises of chaotic dead teem with unlife, with the resources of an entire world without war to spare, not to mention goodly Paladins and Priests by the thousand, these sites have been wiped clean time and time again, but nothing seems to keep the dead in their afterlife for more than a night and a day. Not until the crime of killing not only them, but their entire species en masse is avenged will they be able to rest. For centuries they've walled up, locked inside their dead cities with the Harmonium leadership hoping they stay inside.

One day, they think, when the Harmonium has grown stagnant, fat and weak in their supremecy, they will march forth from their cities, and tear the living apart. Then the shining light of law that was Ortho will be just another dead world, floating aimlessly in the void.

-------------------------------

Nature is the one thing the Harmonium hasn't been able to control. Druids, and Rangers to an extent, have dwindled to almost nonexistence on Ortho. An allegiance to nature over the Harmonium isn't popular, especially with the chaotic bent those classes tend to have (In my games anyways). Over the centuries of Harmonium rule and the advancement of technology, almost every square inch of land has been dug into, built atop of, irrigated, drained, clear-cut, replanted, and otherwise bent to the will of the Harmonium. Where this has happened in our modern world, we see the worldwide effects of overturning Nature's balance. Global Warming will drown us out in a few years, record-breaking Tsunamis and Hurricanes toss our homes around like so much driftwood...

On Ortho, where Mother Nature (or her godly counterparts) are very much real, nature is another force that needs to be Harmonized with the rest of Society. Even still, if all the mystic forces of Nature were mastered, I'm sure the result would be even worse the world itself could concievably be dying. Crop yields fall, forests fail to regrow, streams dry up, the winds stop blowing... Another reason why Ortho is a doomed world, propelling itself towards self-destruction.

..

And, I'm spent.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

'Surreal Personae' wrote:
By the way, how did was it decided on what happened to the chaotic elements? Were they victims of genocide? Forced off the world to other planes? Put in internment camps?

All of the above? Ask what happened to the inhabitents of the first layer of Arcadia when it slipped just recently. I have a few ideas hovering in my mind already...

A deep trench - deeper than anyone thought anyone would ever reach piled full with the remains of the silenced dead. Imagine something the depth of the Marina Trench with a slowly drifting sometimes rumbling awake *mass* of unburied dead.

Also the idea of the story of a child (10ish) who, one day simply playing in the woods behind his house climbing on the large mounds tucked between the roots of trees - finds a single elven skull and brings it home. (Triggering of course a whole series of Intellegience Office visits and truckloads of paperwork... all trying to explain this 'hoax skull' away.)

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The Rilmani were mentioned above - I could see them as a definate force in this world trying to re-set it. Though that may be wandering a bit *too* far from the topics of this thread in regards to background, it's an idea to hold onto for later. Eye-wink

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Ortho: The Beginnings

'Clueless' wrote:
The Rilmani were mentioned above - I could see them as a definate force in this world trying to re-set it. Though that may be wandering a bit *too* far from the topics of this thread in regards to background, it's an idea to hold onto for later. Eye-wink

Though the Rilmani would definatly need more of a reason than just the plane is utterly dominated by law. There are infinent prime worlds, and many are probably dominated by good, evil law or chaos, so "resetting" one world might actually shift things out of balance more than leaving it alone. Thus the actions of the Rilmani would have to be to halt or slow the greater advance of the Harmonium itself rather than just to push the prime back to neutrality. IMHO

Who knows the Harmonium might be a Rilmani tool to counter balance some other growing chaos in the multiverse.

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The Harmonium *did* just slide a planar layer to Mechanus. I think they 'owe' the universe for that. Eye-wink Plus, forcing the Harmonium to focus on the prime world would be a slowing effect. Andddd - off topic. I promise, I'll make another thread for this line of thought.

[Thread Link!]

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So. Back to that adventuring group? 4 members including one druid? That paladin - what god?

Do we have genders in mind for them?

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'ripvanwormer' wrote:
The Flamedance Mountains are the home of the beholders. Motmurk is the home of the orcs. The Empire of Iathra was the dominion of a demon prince the Knights of Harmony ultimately banished.

Heka is a harsh, savage country that trades more with the western continent than the eastern, though it also trades with Voll across the sea.

Voll is a traditional medieval fantasy nation, the homeland of at least one of our heroes.

The Empire of Pan Thaera is an evil place that worships Chaos.

Three-Rivers in the central continent is a biggest city in that land.

Han the Gem-Studded is an exotic port city that specializes in spices and silk, along with the rest of that continent's produce.

So which one gets conquered first?

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Ortho: The Beginnings

'Clueless' wrote:
So. Back to that adventuring group? 4 members including one druid? That paladin - what god?

Do we have genders in mind for them?

Paladin: Romhel of Voll. A knight of noble blood dedicated to all the Lords of Law in an abstract sense. When he became the first Composer of the newly dubbed City of Harmony, he decreed that no lawful god should be set above any other, just as no lawful citizen should be set above any other.

Wizard: Jhary of Heka. Lawful evil (though he masks this with anti-divination items), formally a keeper of Balance, now an outspoken advocate of Order.

Monk: Lawful neutral. Anju, a female warrior (in the broad sense) from an island recently liberated from the Empire of Pan Thaera by a slave revolt. A great believer in personal discipline conquering all.

Druid: Neutral. Mogranhu, a priestess from the northern lands who believed in harmony between civilization and nature. Now primarily remembered as the inspiration for an ornamental garden in the capital city, her actual beliefs twisted to serve civilization's needs.

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Ortho: The Beginnings

'Clueless' wrote:
So which one gets conquered first?

Iathra, technically, with the alliance of the Tyrants of Motmurk. At first, the conquered Iathran lands were shared between the newly allied states of Motmurk and Voll. With peace established in the north and west, the newly created Harmonium order was able to concentrate on defeating the Empire of Pan Thaera to the south, which had never been especially unified anyway. Finally the elves southeast of the Flamedance Mountains, who had long been a thorn in the side of both Pan Thaera and Han the Gem-Studded, were pacified by the new Harmonium-backed Thaeran government with the help of soldiers from Motmurk and Voll, as well as the beholder nations. This particular war lasted decades and anti-elven sentiment rose worldwide until the war expanded to include cordoning all elves into camps, as well as elsewhere.

The other nations were assimilated more or less peacefully in the next few centuries, though individual ethnic areas occasionally rebelled (the map is, of course, far more complicated than I made it seem). Anju's island ironically rebelled most often, despite the Harmonium's liberal use of the hero's name and creed - the rebels used her name, too, for the opposite purpose, though eventually they lost. The druid-led nomads of the north also resisted for a long time. The ancient empire ruled by Han (kind of a Byzantine/Ottoman/Chinese style deal) embraced the war against the elves and found the Harmonium ideals easily adaptable to its bureaucratic religion and often obscure philosophical notions, and much of their culture became incorporated into elements of the Harmonium creed today.

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'Portalhopper' wrote:
Every healthy AD&D world has balance as the driving force behind it, and in Planescape it's doubly so. We've seen what happens when the balance isn't maintained, we know why the Rilmani (among others) are so insistant about it, worlds fall to pieces when the balance isn't maintained.

So why is Ortho so perfect?

One difference has to be the religion. The pantheons of Ortho were entirely adversarial, divided into lawful and chaotic parties that had been in continuous open war over the world since its creation. The pantheon of Krynn, on the other hand, is cooperative; the good and evil gods created the world together and, despite the occasional open battle, have more or less been on speaking terms with one another thanks to an equally strong Balance faction. Ortho's gods didn't have one of those.

There were those in Ortho at the time of the Harmonium's first rise that believed in Balance, but it was not an opinion that the gods shared, and they received no support from the powers that be. The Lords of Law were happy to see their hated foes finally driven from the world.

The rilmani did interfere, had been interfering from the beginning since before their instrument Jhary of Heka turned away from them. Despite several successful cuprilach assassinations of high-level Harmonium officials (including, one at a time, all the original Knights of Harmony and many of the leaders of the various other allied nations) the Harmonium endured, having found purchase in more than one ideological soil. In the end, even with ferrumach legions sent to the aid of the elven lairds, rebellious islands, and other embattled groups, the rilmani simply failed (and, in fact, helping the war with the elves last so long only made things worse for them in the end). Whether the natives of the Planes of Law were willing to dedicate more resources to this one world than their chaotic or neutral rivals or whether this operation was simply bungled as the rilmani response to Rajaat had been, Balance failed in this world.

Note, as an aside, that Rajaat was actually created by the rilmani under the leadership of the argenach Jemorille, later known as the Exile for that snafu and many others. Is it possible Ortho also showed Jemorille's silver hand at work? Perhaps the Knights of Harmony were also the result of his inspiration.

You're right, of course, that a world cannot go so far out of Balance without suffering. Here are some possible ideas:

1. Magic itself is diminished in the world, due to the flight of the fey.
2. Positive energy is somewhat diminished as well. The soil is less fertile and childbirth is less frequent.
3. The sun is affected, turning reddish in color.

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Hm. That moves that 'trench' of elven undead off the south peninsula there, or perhaps on the outer edge of Thera...

And Jemorille? God I hate him, considering how many of his operations are complete foulups - he's incompetant. Eye-wink This could lead to the exploration of a return of rilmani action in the current timeperiod as the rilmani feel the need to correct some of the effects. At this *this* prime isn't cut off from the rest of the planes like the *last* one was.

...

As the world because assimilated into the Harmonium alliance, it became more and more clear that the leadership of such a wide ranging power would require an effort of nearly godlike proportions. They would all as a world need to argee on resources, trade, managing from the smallest level to the highest to live in Harmony together. The rulers of the allied nations did not act without some expectation of returns, and the Harmonium had to answer. When it was difficult to so much as send a message from one side of the empire to the other, the task was neigh impossible.

It was with this in mind that the first travel lanes we opened. Blasting through the mountian passes with distinegration and carving the land before them straight and flat with the aid of beholder engineers - a network of roads grew across the continents. Wide and straight as an arrow allowing trade, and troops to move with comparatively blinding speed. The roads paved with flagstones three feet wide on a side and perfectly fitted to each other.

All distances were marked from the one point of true nuetrality in the Empire - the conquered and destroyed capital of the Long Lived Ones, the rebellious elves. Once called Shilvestra'lkhana - the Shining Towers - the city became known as Harmony's Glory, a nuetral place unclaimed by any of the allied nations and home to the Highest of the Harmonium Order.

In the first few years of Harmony's Glory, the clerics of Law, and the Harmonium highest finding a gathering power in their belief hallowed the grounds in the name of law laying to 'final' rest the sobbing ghosts of the Long Lived. Their ghosts would have to rest elsewhere...

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'ripvanwormer' wrote:
You're right, of course, that a world cannot go so far out of Balance without suffering. Here are some possible ideas: 1. Magic itself is diminished in the world, due to the flight of the fey. 2. Positive energy is somewhat diminished as well. The soil is less fertile and childbirth is less frequent. 3. The sun is affected, turning reddish in color.

I would say no on the positive energy thing. Not hte least because the world still recieves the care and attention of gods and has no loss of connection with the Planes, I honestly don't believe the actions here would truly affect any connection to the positive energy plane. It's generic 'energy' after all....

Now the sun turning red, that sounds like a *very* delightful plot turn a little later in the history - or more like current history. And would affect plant life certainly.

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'Clueless' wrote:
Hm. That moves that 'trench' of elven undead off the south peninsula there, or perhaps on the outer edge of Thera...

That'd work, although I'm sure there were a number of other elven communities, both major and minor.

Everything else you said sounds very good.

There could be disagreement on what exactly the red sun portends. Some might think it means Ortho is finally ascending into the Outer Planes, while others might see it as a sign from the long-banished Lords of Chaos that another rebellion is needed.

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Harmony's Glory became the central capital for the Harmonium way of life - not quite a pilgramage - not quite a place of political bickering. Harmony's Glory certainly was the center of retention of knowledge - though some scholars whispered of ruins below the city, from some forgotten city forged by hands no one recognized. Scrolls written in a tongue none recognized, forgotten by time and the deliberate forgetfullness of those in power. And all the while perhaps once every fifty years - rare to the human lifespan, ships would disappear in thick fog and open sea off the coast of Thera.

Of cours, the Harmonium Way was already the 'claimed' belief of many of the allied nations, but belief on a core level to the single individual was still not accomplished.

To do that took a wedding of the Harmonium Way to the religious. The gods of Law pairing with the Harmonium. Memberships merging, and slowly the Harmonium became one of a trilogy of authorities that the peoples of the world turned to: State, Church, and the Harmonium. The State was responsible for caring for the people's bodies, the Church for caring for their souls, and the Harmonium for tending over the Laws and Ideals that guided their actions.

The Harmonium gained membership in the highest of the churches of law left in the world. And with that came the first schism of the Lawful Good against the Lawful Evil...

[Tags to someone else, or if some else has a good spin off point? This is all sort of crunched together as an idea... (mix well with other ideas, add garlic... yum!) ]

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'ripvanwormer' wrote:
That'd work, although I'm sure there were a number of other elven communities, both major and minor.

Oh *certainly*... Like I said, that thought of a little boy finding a skull in the mounds in the forest behind his home... but I'd think if the masses of that main elven nation as a whole were dumped there - especially if the dead ones were removed to there as well when their bones were found in excavation? It could become a focus point for the elven pantheon.

Opps. I think we forgot to kill off halflings.
And where are the dwarves and gnomes again?
We forgot the short species... Eye-wink

Or. Wait - we have an entire underdark to go with. Perhaps the halflings fled below? Underdark halflings?

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I can see the present day Ortho being alot like the movie "Equilibrium" or the book "1984", with a HUGE Big Brother or Big Sister thing going on.

As for the four first adventurers, I like the idea of the Druid being female. Maybe she IS LN and is slipping twards True Neutral. She becomes, over a long amount of time, more accepting of chaos. Maybe SHE is the one that falls, like the biblical Lillith from the Garden of Eden, twards The Empire of Pan Thaera, and becomes a protector of the chaos ridden people who still search and fight for their right to freedom. She becomes like a goddess to them when she dies, it would be great if the Druid was elven for a longer life span to play this all out in. She could become the Forbidden Goddess, the one that you worship in the darkness, in corners, in secret, amoungst the Harmonium population. And maybe she is exhaulted in The Empire of Pan Thaera as the Forbidden Goddess. Worshipped in the open, statues and temples openly shown to all to worship her.

Just some thoughts that I thought would work nicely. Also, check out "Equilibrium" or reread or watch "1984" and get a real feel for what exactly the Harmonium could do. I like the idea of the Paladin reaching greatness within the Harmonium and maybe using her/him as Big Sister/Brother, probably not using that name though.

Well, I have rambled long enough. Sticking out tongue

"Now back to your normally scheadualed program."

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I can go for some forbidden Goddess worshippers in the crannies of the world. Perhaps... :

A single lone symbol of Her power remains, kept in close secret by those handful who remain and by the quiet innermost circle of the northern Druidic Circle - a standing stone with a hole bored through it by time and wind stands on the peak of the southernmost continent that juts out into the waters. The stone itself is relatively unimportant. But placing a single green leaf and acorn within the hole and it flares to life - a portal to the Lady Druid's last sanctuary in Arcadia. (Ties into current events later with that little 'shifting plane' incident.) This temple teaches the truth of the original Harmonium way, uncorrupted by time and greed: That it comes from the simple desire to see peace and coexistance of all.

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Very nice addition on the Forbidden Goddess aspect Clueless Laughing out loud .

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Random question and then I'm going to bed. No really.

Where are the central resource points in this world?
Aka:

Where's the best iron ore? Coal? Gold and silver mines?
What about the best places to find salt? Spices?
Where is the "bread basket" for the world - food?
And where are the great forests for ship masts and furniture?

We need to answer those questions so that we know what will provoke economic trouble within the Empire between haves and have-nots. We can assume that a certain communist-like economy will prevail in many areas, but I'm not too sure it will prevail *everywhere* not when folks are seeing the fruits of their hard labor being given away to people they don't even known. Especially since the Harmonium's army needs to eat and have supplies. They don't just produce lawyers out of Harmony's Glory after all.

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'Clueless' wrote:
Random question and then I'm going to bed. No really.

Where are the central resource points in this world?
Aka:

Where's the best iron ore? Coal? Gold and silver mines?

TheFlamedance Mountains would be the area where the gold and silver would be best mined. Think Africa. Also precious stones, aka diamonds, would be found there.

The coal, steal, iron ore would be found in the Empire of Iathra. Think Pennsilvania and the mid-western states.

Quote:
What about the best places to find salt? Spices?

Spices would be best found in the Han empire area. Think India and the Spice Trade.

Quote:
Where is the "bread basket" for the world - food? And where are the great forests for ship masts and furniture?

Southern Motmurk would be the best place to have the harvest land. Think the middle of America. Maybe Northern Motmurk for the timber. Thinking Northern America and Canada. Maybe the Empire of Thaera for exotic woods and precious stones. Think of the South Pacific. Thaera could also be involved in the Spice Trade, pirating ship filled with pirates and mercanaries.

-Ophelia

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'Clueless' wrote:
Opps. I think we forgot to kill off halflings. And where are the dwarves and gnomes again? We forgot the short species... Eye-wink

There might not have been any halflings or gnomes (at least, they weren't mentioned in the Factol's Manifesto). Of course, if someone has a great idea for gnomes, halflings, or Deep Halflings, there's no reason not to go with it.

Generic gnomes and halflings both have lawful-tending gods, so they might have been spared (though the gnomes and halflings of Ortho might have been different).

I'm not sure what the homeland of the dwarves might have been. I guess Motmurk, with the orcs, though more in the penninsulas and such. The northern penninsulas of that continent look like the Scandinavia of this world (with major differences, of course).

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a couple ideas- was it mentioned in the Factols manifesto if the Harmonium Factol was the Leader of all Harmonium, or just the Commander of Harmonium actions on the Planes?

Also- I have to ask- has any consideration been given to Orthos Crystal sphere? To control Ortho, the Harmonium would have to have a fairly strong navy, and I cant help but think that the discovery of Spelljamming would cause the Harmonium to create a sunstantial spelljamming navy, if only out of a continuation of their naval tradition.

But I'm just thinking, if their was another habitable planet in the shpere, who says that the Chaotic aligned gods didnt simply steal away enough of their preists to keep themselves from dying out, and now there is a small colony o f outlawed races living close inisde The Crystal sphere.

Or better yet. The idea of spelljamming is a big secret, and while the extraplanar harmonium know about it, Spelljamming on Ortho is very hush-hush. Think about Harmoium style men in black showing up when a fisherman discovers an odd looking boat with a metal chair inside.

It could be that the Harmoium dont care about spelljamming enough to build ships, but the colony of outlawed races has been, every so slowly, building a navy. Their revenge against the harmoium that killed off so many of their race.

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...

So the elves and halflings were exterminated, but the orcs survived?

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The orcs were probably one of the oldest members of the alliance...

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'Fidrikon' wrote:
a couple ideas- was it mentioned in the Factols manifesto if the Harmonium Factol was the Leader of all Harmonium, or just the Commander of Harmonium actions on the Planes?

I'm not sure if it specified. I like Richard Gant's theory:

Quote:
The Harmonium is ruled by Ortho. The Factol is a member of Ortho's Octave Council. The Factol has always been a member of the Octave Council. Despite the relative populations of Ortho and the Harmonium of the Planes (Ortho has a population of about 2 billion; it is *estimated* that Arcadia alone has fifty times as many members of the Faction, and there are more scattered throughout the Outer, Inner, and Prime planes), Ortho considers their Outer Planar holdings to be nothing more than a colony. The official title of the "colony leader" is Governor-General.

Quote:
Also- I have to ask- has any consideration been given to Orthos Crystal sphere?

Yes, here.

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This may be the biggest problem for us: I just checked with the Factol's Manifesto. The Harmonium has gotten from 'Founding' to 'Now' in about 510 years. We may need to take a closer look at how these time lines are laid out. 500 years doesn't sound like much. But then - 500 years ago we were in 1505 and had just discovered the New World.... so there can be some major advancement in just 500 years.

Ok. It may help us to organize the History of Ortho into some periods so that we can fill from point A to point B and know where we're going. With this in mind:

The Age of Deep Darkness
Before the coming of the Way of Harmony, the land was conquered by demons. The strong held all the power, and Chaos held sway.
The beginning to year -30.

Realization
The learning of the founders of the Way of Harmony. The establishment of the first City of Harmony, and Voll's peace.
Years -30 to year 0.

The Expansion
Conquering and driving back the darkness. Concluded with the destruction of the elven homeland and the elves.
Years 0 to year 100.

The First Harmony
Construction of the Empire and the Harmonium's word spread. The beholders built roads across the world, and trade flourished. The harmonium became the primary advisory force throughout the world, and begins to ally with the Churches.
Years 100 to 200. (roughly)

The Schism
The Harmonium comes to criticize itself in the first major reformation of policies and methodology. The alliance of the Harmonium with the Churches of Lawful Evil tendencies comes into question causing a civil war. Peace returns with the mediation of a Lawful Nuetral group. (Needs more details here!)
Years 201 to 205.

The Second Harmony
A period of Reformation and reestablishment. The new provinces of the Empire were laid out, to be run by the local 'triad' of power: State, Church, and Harmonium. The provinces in some cases deliberately mangle old lines of the traditional nations. The Harmonium adopts military-esque hierarchy for it's provincial regulation.
Years 206 to 297.

The War of Iron
Continued rebellions in remote areas, and the dedication of some populations to holding onto their superstitions prompt the Harmonium to advise the Council of Ortho (on which their head holds a seat) to seek out the source of this rebellion and evil. The Planes are discovered and the first assault on the Abyss occurs and fails miserably. (Hence the name of the War considering the tanar'ri allergy to iron.)
Years 297 to 306.

Colonization
The Harmonium spreads, establishing a colony of like believers in Sigil and around the Planes, expanding their belief and power base. Ortho sees an influx of resources from the planes, though there is very strict control on the influx of people and ideas from outside of Ortho.
Years 306 to 510.

How many leaders for the Harmonium have happened in this time? (What is the average lifespan of a human, orc, or beholder?)

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Something of an upper and lord house of governement...

The Council of Ortho:

A representive council that passes laws and determines provincial governmental projects and budgets for the entire planet. The council consists of:

A representative of the state from each major province
A representative of the/a church from each major province
A representative of the Harmonium from each major province

The Planar activites is considered just another province, though that is rapidly becoming a sticking point.

Provinces are arranged in a classical fuedal structure - Major provinces, contain smaller ones, and those contain smaller and so on. Internal matters within provinces is often handled by however the triad of authority figures deems the 'right' way to handle it. Depending on the alignments of those in charge this can range from benevolent to very not nice. Harmony's Glory - as a nuetral location within the Empire is not represented as a province.

The Octave Council
Consists of eight members. The top two highest members from the state, the top two highest members from the churches (usually of opposing alignments on the Lawful scale), and the Factol and second in command of the Harmonium. The last two seats are held by a wizard choosen to represent the magically giften of Ortho, and a lawyer - both choosen from the province of Harmony's Glory. Members of this council cannot also have seats in the Orthos council. The Octave Council can override the vote of the Ortho Council with a 5 to 1 vote, though they do so rarely. The Ortho Council can override the Octave Council only with a 3/4 majority.

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*kicks the thread over... like kicking a rock over to look for the bugs underneath* Eye-wink

I figure controlling the flow of information from the planes to Ortho is fairly high in the Harmonium's priority list. As a result, certain spells are likely to be on a Forbidden list - where you have to have special permission to learn or teach them, and an approved reason for the good of all to use them. For example: Planeshift and Gate. Any other spells on that list anyone can think of? Obviously anything to summon demons is *right* out.

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Don't forget, no summoning any chaotic celestials, or outsiders, as well.

-Ophelia

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If there are eight people in charge of Ortho, perhaps there should have been eight original Knights of Harmony.

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That would certainly explain an increased capability to do what they did. I went with 8 mostly because of the name: Octave.

Perhaps it started with four - and then as the allies came in four more were added? An orc, a beholder, and two other folks?

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I think an elf from the Elven Shaar (the elven kingdom) and a human from Heka (the savage lands) would fit nicely as the other two to add to that group Clueless.

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Er... I'm not too sure the elf would go along with things considering what happens to the elven kingdom soon after the founding of the adventuring group. I think having at most one elf (the druid, destined to be the 'fallen member') is gonna be enough. Anything more than that and it'll start not making sense for why they took down the elven kingdom.

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History of the Hardheads in Sigil

Harmonium 300 (Hashkar -74): Corwin of Anchor, the last survivor of Ortho's invasion of the Abyss, becomes the first Harmonium soldier known to set foot in Sigil. She remains trapped there for a time before discovering a portal to Arcadia.

Harmonium 306 (Hashkar -68): The Harmonium sets up shop in Sigil. Grateful to have someone to take over law enforcement, the Guvners give the Hardheads the City Barracks. (Factol's Manifesto, 70)

Harmonium 307 (Hashkar -67): An ambitious Harmonium factor learns of the blasphemous beliefs of the Athar and leads a full-scale attack on the Shattered Temple. The factor is mazed by the Lady of Pain, but discrete guerilla raids continue against the Athar for a long time. Eventually, the Harmonium gives up and takes its case to the Hall of Speakers, gaining the Fated and Mercykillers as allies against the Lost. (FM, Cool

Harmonium 308 (Hashkar -66): Some of the Hardheads' allies send them to pacify the Doomguard, who have been a thorn in their sides since the Great Upheaval. The Sinkers conquer the Armory, hole themselves inside it, and open war between the Harmonium and Doomguard continues in Sigil's streets for months. The Lady of Pain does not choose to interfere, although the dabus repair roads and structures damaged in the fighting. The Doomguard finally calls off hostilities when the other factols threaten to revoke their faction status. The Doomguard swears a blood oath to "never again instigate a war in the Cage." In exchange, the Sinkers get to keep the Armory. (FM 40)

Harmonium 350 (Hashkar -24): The Harmonium factol is assassinated by a few members of the newly founded Xaositect faction. The cause of death is an hourglass the Chaosfolk launched at his brain-box. Whether this was deliberate homicide or the unintended result of some bizarre prank is unclear, and probably doesn't matter. (FM 152)

Harmonium 429 (Hashkar 56): The "Empyrean Harmonies" vogue among the Believers of the Source draws the ire of the Hardheads, and covert bloodshed rages between the Great Foundry and the City Barracks. (FM 18)

Harmonium 449 (Hashkar 76): A young githzerai named Omar rises rapidly through the Harmonium ranks. (FM 114)

Harmonium 450 (Hashkar 77): The githzerai Omar is named factol of the Harmonium. The newly elected factol announces that the Harmonium's mission is now complete. The faction will disband throughout the planes and the City Barracks must now be shut down. The lesser factors arrest him, and in the course of the trial Omar reveals his true allegiance to the Revolutionary League. Omar is swiftly "made short work of," and the next factol announces that of course everyone knew what Omar was all along; they were only stringing him along so he'd unintentionally reveal information about his confederates. (FM 114)

Harmonium 500 (Hashkar 127): Publication of The Factol's Manifesto

Harmonium 503 (Hashkar 130): The Faction War.

Harmonium 504 (Postbellum 1): The Harmonium officially abandons Sigil, leaving law enforcement in the Cage to the Sodkillers, Sons of Mercy, and the Planes-Militant.

Harmonium 510 (Postbellum 7): Today

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Why the heck did they attack the Athar, of all the factions they could have picked? I mean, you'd think they target the Anarchists long before then, given that the goals of the two factions are in direct opposition.

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I guess politics of the time? Or maybe they talked smack about somone's momma? Eye-wink

Anyone got any idea for some gods for our intrepid Harmonium world? If the orcs are civilized here then I'm sure they're going to need a new set. (I'll admit, some evil part of me wants to play an orc with a British accent and a habit of dressing in waistcoat and trou.)

Ditto for the beholders needing gods.

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'nick012000' wrote:
Why the heck did they attack the Athar, of all the factions they could have picked? I mean, you'd think they target the Anarchists long before then, given that the goals of the two factions are in direct opposition.

They probably started going against the Revolutionary League as soon as they found out about them, but their first encounter with the Anarchs isn't recorded in the book.

They targeted the Athar because the Harmonium believes in the use of religion to create conformity and harmony, and the Athar were a direct threat to their creed. If the gods aren't worthy of respect, why should any part of the Harmonium philosophy be worthy of respect? If people no longer believe in the divine order, why should they believe in any order?

The ironic thing is, almost nobody really knew what the Athar believed in until the Harmonium made a fuss over them. The other factions knew some kind of faction had set up in the Shattered Temple, but the Lost weren't big on proselytizing until they felt their existence was threatened. Up to that point, they were like the Bleakers - people who needed them were quietly taken in, and they didn't worry about anyone else. Post-Hardheads they became almost an anti-Harmonium, giving public tours of god husks in the Astral, littering the Cage with pamphlets and tracts, and in all ways actively trying to turn as many people as they could away from other factions and toward their own.

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'Clueless' wrote:
Anyone got any idea for some gods for our intrepid Harmonium world? If the orcs are civilized here then I'm sure they're going to need a new set. Ditto for the beholders.

We need a lawful good religion and a lawful evil religion to schism. Perhaps they were native to two different continents, and didn't come into contact until the unified Harmonium creed forced them to. Perhaps one group revered the Hebdomad while the other revered the Lords of the Nine, and the Schism was finally resolved by forbidding anyone from worshipping planar lords. From then on, the paragons of planar races could be honored, but only as intermediaries between mortals and the true gods.

Maybe there aren't any racial gods in Ortho, just Lords of Law and Lords of Chaos who accepted faithful from any race (like the situation with the gods of Krynn). Maybe there was an earlier pantheon before the Lords of Law and Chaos invaded, and that pantheon is now mostly or entirely forgotten (but would still like their world back).

That said, I'm not sure that "civilized" beholders couldn't revere the Great Mother like most other beholders do. The Great Mother doesn't match any beholder's alignment, really, and they worship her anyway. I think that Ortho's beholders are probably still lawful evil and mostly as xenophobic as any group, but they've accepted the beliefs of the Harmonium and won't attack fellow Hardheads (unless pressed). They just use the Harmonium philosophy as an excuse to focus their xenophobia on members of other factions. I like the idea of them using their disintegration beams to create roads, but mostly it's only going to be the "mad" beholders who are fully integrated into Ortho's greater society.

The Lords of Law should represent various aspects of law, order, and harmony. Seven seems like a good number, or perhaps eight if that's to be Ortho's theme.

I'm not trying to come up with names right now (maybe they don't have any), but, keeping in mind that I'm using "Lord" in the gender neutral sense. Maybe they don't have genders, either.

I. Lord of Discipline (also the god of the military, of agriculture, and of children. Formally the god of war.)
II. Lord of Bookkeepers, Copyists, Proper Knowledge, and (to a lesser extent) Invention
III. Lord of Hierarchy (formally the god of kings and nobles, when Ortho had any. Represents obedience and respect for authortity. Thought of as a divine factol of sorts.)
IIII. Lord of Peace and Harmony (formally the god of martyrs and healing, in the time when the Lords of Law and Chaos knew nothing but war)
V. Lord of Death and Judgement (who once judged all the souls of the people of Ortho, but whose duties have declined as the Harmonium has become more planar. Now this god is more the patron of mortal judges and the peacemaking go-between of all gods of the dead)
VI. Lord of Silence (representing things that are forbidden to speak of)
VII. Lord of Watchfulness (who knows everyone's sins and whose priests use divination spells to know the same)
VIII. Lord of Music (the Harmonium prefers military marching bands, but this god represents all music as long as it respects rules of composition and harmony, which the clerics of this god teach and make judgements on).

Forgotten Gods (gods who are no longer remembered since the Lords of Law and Chaos consumed the world in their war)

- goddess of nature (who a certain druid became the proxy/avatar of)
- goddess of fey
- the beholder Great Mother (I changed my mind)
- Gruumsh, Corellon Larethian, and so on
- goddess of agriculture
- god of storms and weather
- trickster god
- androgynous god/goddess of magic
- god of, um, giant reptiles

I think of the Lords of Law as something like the original Roman pantheon, which was so boring that the Romans eagerly adopted the gods of other cultures, which brings us to planar gods commonly worshipped on Ortho:

- St. Cuthbert (one of the most popular)
- Torm
- Koriel
- Paladine
- Chung Kuel (god of truth and testing)
- K'ung Fu-tzu
- Shang-ti

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'Clueless' wrote:
I guess politics of the time? Or maybe they talked smack about somone's momma? Eye-wink

Anyone got any idea for some gods for our intrepid Harmonium world? If the orcs are civilized here then I'm sure they're going to need a new set. (I'll admit, some evil part of me wants to play an orc with a British accent and a habit of dressing in waistcoat and trou.)

Ditto for the beholders needing gods.


The orcs of Ortho likely are dedicated mostly to Ilneval, who I personally can't see as a CE type even with the big 3E alignment shift. His priests are probably one of the core backers of the Tyrants of Motmurk, and spread out from there with an Inquisition once the Harmonium really took off. Other canon deities probably include Yurtrus, appreciated for divine work in spreading plagues among the elves, and Luthic is assumed to have been 'claimed' by a victorious Ilneval as a mate. (Worship of Luthic is probably also the only safe way for orcs regressing to chaos to hold to their old faith.)

The other possibility for a lawful orcish deity is an orcish hero who actually rises to godhood shortly before the establishment of the Harmonium. Helping this individual achieve divinity might have been one of the main epic quests of the original four heroes.

As for the beholders... why not have them be atheists, or believers in complete abstract Law? They've got huge amounts of arcane power as it is, a separate racial deity doesn't seem to be something they'd likely lack...

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I kind of think there isn't really a seperate orc culture anymore - that humans, orcs, and dwarves are all integrated (or brainwashed, depending on your point of view) into one people. Ilneval seems like a pretty good choice for the Harmonium in general, and for planar Harmonium orcs. Khurgorbaeyag seems like a pretty good Hardhead god, too.

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Perhaps they pulled a trick from the Roman handbook on that? Take your overall 8 Lords - and then turn the local religion into 'Aspects Of', or into local household gods? That way we can still allow for "peasant superstitions" in some areas - you know, the kind that make good plot hooks and flavorings later, while over all using the 8 Lords as a basis?

And - did the 8 Lords come after that Schism conflict? When the Harmonium realized it would be better to subsume any lingering pantheons into a single structure?

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I think that the Lords of the 8 would definately come after the schism. They would come and "clean-up" what that war left behind. They would bring peace, harmony, and law to a once lawless land. At first the people would be greatful for this peace, until they started getting the REAL idea of what is going on. But by then it is too late, the Harmonium has taken over enough of the people to sway the many. "It is better not to protest that which has brought us peace." could be a saying of the elders of the land, to try to pursuade the younger generation to "follow-along, or else!"

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