Night Hags, larvae and Hordlings

I have allways had impression that hordlings don´t bother hags much and vice wersa. True, larvae that turn ito hordlings is bad for buisnes and represent lost profit. But it seems that Hags would have done something about it allready.

Maybe Hags assisted Yugoloths in creation of Hordlings, so from that there would be explained hordling affection for hags (another reason why Yugoloths were displeased by Hordlings, after all you dont want slaverace that serves 2 masters).

Heh heh. That last bit about Hags with Hordeling pets made me think of a less intelligent than average Night Hag with a Smarter than average Hordeling slave/pet that looks fairly unimpressive. The little guy is basically forcing the Hag to do its bidding by outsmarting her and convincing her that all these things were really her ideas. The question is, what would a Hordeling make a Hag research/create/destroy/spy on for it?

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Also, I like all this pet stuff. Only it would be more efficient to use Hordelings or their excremetns as dung to raise trees.. and not burn their bones.

I imagine most trees can't grow in the Gray Wastes. It's not that there's nothing for the trees to live off of; the sheer palpable aura of despair just makes any plant-life that doesn't feed off of gloom (see: Gloomweed) incapable of growing.

The Lurklings provide a constant, renewable, cheap, easily accessible source of building material, food, and labor. I really find the idea that the entire plane's ecology, economy, and even architecture is constructed around them fascinating--after all, why go through the trouble of growing trees and orchids when you can just slaughter a pack of lurklings for all the material and fire fuel you'll ever need? It makes the larva all the more valuable, too--in a pinch, they can be converted to lurklings, which through some alchemical procedure can be processed into mortar, bricks, or other building material.

It makes the hags more important, too--after all, the hags are the ones who know the processes by which lurkling corpses can be converted into edible food, building material, or burnable flame. It's not just something anyone can do--maybe some of the knowledge seeps out into general native knowledge (I imagine they'd need to know a little of this, just to survive), but in general it's the hags who run all the industry of the plane and hock their wares to those who are traveling through (often in exchange for larva, which are more valuable to them).

It really makes the hag's relationship with the lurklings (and furthermore, the hordelings) interesting, too--after all, without the lurklings, the hags would have trouble turning a profit or producing materials for their various industries. I imagine they have an almost affectionate relationship with many lurkings, while simultaneously shoveling countless atrocities and horrors upon their race--cooing softly to a quivering lurkling and relaxing it with pets and soothing scratches before dumping it into a boiling cauldron, whistling cheerfully while it screams. But again, a keynote of this relationship is that it's the LURKLINGS who are at the bottom of the ladder--not the Hordelings in general (who probably treat the lurklings much the same).

Sorry if I come across as pushy sometimes--I just spit ideas out by the hundreds, so sometimes it sounds like I'm pulling a 'my-way-or-the-highway' thing. I always expect people to just comb through my giant blurbs and basically just pull out the good parts from the bad.

Good point; the lurklings make great firewood for the parts in the plane where there aren't trees or plants growing. And of course the plane does have native fauna--it's just gotta be either really robust or manage to feast off of the apathy and gloom to survive.

Infact, some lurklings might even be trees.

Nighthags may, in fact, get to determine much of a lurkling's progress. This entwines Nighthags even more with lurklings; perhaps, through various alchemical processes, nighthags can convert larva into a lurkling with specific features that they want. This allows nighthags to make lurklings who will serve as able-bodied guard-dogs, or trees with poisonous fruit (and each fruit has nasty, nasty teeth), or even tentacled horrors to guard the stairs down into their basement.

Edit: One alternate possibility--or maybe it's a dark that no one has confirmed--is that the night hags are responsible for lurklings. Not even the Hordelings know this, and if they did, they'd be pissed as hell for the most part--it would mean that the Night Hags have been hamstringing their race for countless centuries by snatching up larva who would potentially become powerful hordelings, robbing them of their identity, and converting them into pretty powerless lurklings for the Night Hag's own purposes.

That sounds awesome.

Man, I need to actually sit down and buy some real Planescape supplements.

I'm literally just functioning off of hearsay and the seat of my pants, here.

I shall discourage you on that, unless your house stands on golden pillars. (for example In the Cage costs >100€ on amazon germany).

To be not completely offT: Let's make the woods a bit more.. diversiefied, yes? "Woods like in Ancient Greece" or so is less boring than "Mostly Olive Trees".

This would definitely inject a new dynamic to the hag/hordling relationship, especially those who seem to work for/be kept as pets by the Grey Sisters. Despite rage, cruelty, and callousness both sides would have a reason to cooperate with each other - if you even need a reason other than 'Yugoloths'

I've been quiet these last few weeks, but I'll try to get more involved again... great work so far everyone!

Hmmm, 'What can change the nature of a Hordling?'

I absolutely adore the idea that re-pupating Hordelings sometimes must rely on the Night Hags for protection, and that Hordelings go through some sort of chrysalis stage when they change enough (kind of like insects shedding off its skin), reverting to larva and re-emerging as something else. This might be a better alternative to my 'Eat-Another-Hordeling' evolution idea (although I still love the image of Hordelings just eating Lurklings to regain hitpoints).

One thing, though--I think that though the hags definitely turn potential Hordelings into lurklings (and even control what form they take for their own maligned purposes), lurklings do occur naturally as well. The Hags might be responsible for the first lurklings (this would be an optional dark, of course), but they aren't responsible for the countless lurklings that pop up on the plane--not anymore, anyway. This is important because there are just so damn many lurklings, the hags could never produce them all.

It could still be for personal evolution, just at a very high risk of the 'evolving' hordeling's individuality. Thus, it is rarely undertaken unless at dire need. Any more than, say, three such lurkling grafts at a time threatens to overwhelm the hordeling's ego. To put more on safely, one must be taken off.

Also, just to poke fun at how similar these guys are becoming to the Zerg, since there are hordelings of all imaginable shapes and sizes, do you think there are hordeling buildings? Perhaps entire towns of squishy flesh and tooth filled doors that produces some very interesting enzymes that can be imbibed as potions for augmenting the body. These buildings are deadly for anyone but other hordelings to enter, although one with sufficient power or the proper knowledge can hold the maw open and not be digested as they collect the juices inside.

Okay, I think I was misunderstood. I am against permanent evolution as you are, joyblood. I'm talking about temporary grafts that can be removed and turned back into autonimous lurklings. And Hippo, while statwise it might be a pain, since only other hordelings can do this and it is unlikely that a PC will be a hordeling, you don't actually need to write exact rules for this process. It's more flavour text - "You see the large, heavily built hordeling in front of you charge through the horde directly towards you. Without pausing, it snatches up a spikey looking lurkling and rams it onto its head, turning it into a bony horn and making its charge seem that much deadlier."

Also, about the houses thing, I want to direct your attention to page 91 of Faces of Evil. There is chant of a village of hordelings that have managed to overcome their hatereds and are trying to fight both the despair of the plane and their own evil natures. As perfect a place for slimy toothy buildings (or gingerbread houses) as you ever could want, no?

I picture that city as being fairly small, no more than maybe 100 hordelings. There are perhaps 3 or 4 relatively powerful and intelligent hordelings running the show, and they are genuinely trying to be nice and push aside their nature. Out of the rest of the group, maybe 50% sort of understand the concept and are trying, another 30% aren't intelligent enough to know what it means and are just along for the ride, and the rest are playing along until something better comes along.

I have this image of Hordelings wandering around with crudely drawn instruction books, trying to remember if they're supposed to greet visitors or eat them, which kinds of bodily expulsions are appropriate, and whether it's better to kill or maim.

The buildings could be a random hodgepodge of normal houses, houses built of bone or flesh, living houses, houses that look right, but aren't put together in anything resembling the correct way inside, and so on. It's a work in progress where a full third of the workers have the strength of a bear and the intelligence and attention span of a third grader, but with an inherent drive to kill, despoil, and desecrate.

Just rambling

So, kind of like an evil version of Fraggle Rock, right?

If Hymneth decides not to work the place up I will.

Armoury, consider living buildings. Please? I have developed a soft-spot for building shaped hordelings over the course of the day, even if they are a lot like the Zerg. Maybe include just one, the founder of the town. He was once mobile, but as his evil abated, so too did his mobility. He is now the town's grand hall and meeting spot, giving instructions as both a mayor and a mayor's house.

PS: Smiley no worky.

Speaking of hordlings looking like trees and things. I was recently sketching a few designs I'd been thinking of for a hordling lord that was similar to this concept. It was essentially a great tree that was comprised of a mish mash of eyes, gaping mouths, arms reaching out and a few hideous looking branches that look like melting arms and fingers.

I think I have a few ideas for a hordling building though now. So kudos to the people!!!

As for "hordlingsville" I think that these particular hordling should be definately some of the toughest bashers around. I mean, look at what they have to deal with. Wasting emotion and hope. Yugolotha attacks. Moral crisis. Hag manipulation. Lack of any resources better than their own bodies. Blood war battle fields opening all over the place. Sheer hatred and mistrust from anyone who is even remotely unconnected from the lower planes. Mid life crisis. Family issues. Rising tax rates. World famine. Bad poetry. Relationships. Dance choreography. Betrayal from within. Proper pet care and maintenence. And of course going in day after day with the knowledge that everything they set out to achieve could be gone tommorow. I think they should be good. But very, very xenophobic and perhaps even impolite to anyone outside their walls. Emphasis on the very.

Zeniel wrote:

Iä, Iä, Shub-Niggurath, The Black Goat of The Woods with Thousand Young.

Good idea. But I just had to chant that, also Idea of tiefling inbreeding is also great one, for Planescape/Mythos horror crossover. I like it.

That would explain a lot. I just assumed they couldn't breed without strong magic.

Well,...

With Night Hags being Neutral Evil, I tend to think of them as the sorts of beings that only take action if they are "interested", they might act out of envy, spite, hatred, curiosity or even a selfish sort of love, but NEVER altruistically. This should be driven home when having any interaction with them.

Examples might include a "favored" being (Hordling, human or whatever) that the Hag for all intents and purposes seems to care for greatly. This creature may seem to have it made from first glance, but the hags affections will involve emotional and possibly physical crippling to "protect" this "beloved pet".

I like drakes Idea of the hordling being a young new 'loth successors.

However I strongly disagree that its all a plan by the baernaloths and that they orignally created the Tannari and Baatezu. They control them, supposedly, they didn't create them. We can find evidence of this because look what happened to Apomps the exiled baernoloth when he created his chaotic version of 'loths the 'leths. Exile. Plus the story of the baernoloths existence is not even definite fact. Then again in a place where belief is power what is a fact?

Besides what with the 'loths moving into Gehenna and all that I would of assumed that their race is slowly, very slowy becoming too lawful and as such are abandoning the waste to its soon to be new successors, the Hordlings, although the hags'd definatly have to fit in their somewhere.

Hey I never said they were tainted unwillingly.
Also Gehenna's only slightly lawful. Plus anyone group or individual living on any plane beyond their original will so find themselves develping certain characteristic from that plane. Remember the planes are more powerful than the fiends combined.