So, it looks like most people are in favor of the Modrons upgrading themselves through the creation of new varients of the Monodrone through Pentadrone classes. Now what?
I sugest we stat the base castes as follows:
Mono CR 1/2 [No change]
Duo CR2
Tri CR 4
Quad CR 6
Penta CR 8
Varients to fall within +/- 1CR of the standard form.
Heirarchs CR [as current, 10-20]
Heirarchs to have no varients.
What does everyone else think?
I wanted to make it as easy as possible for DMs to homebrew their own modrons to suprise their players, to that end, I wanted to be sure that modrons could cover a variety of CRs and that the number of variants was not limited.
That's why I left Monodrone's CR as-is, so that Duodrones could be CR1-3 and Monodrones could be CR 1/3-1.
From the Modrons' point of view:
Its not logical to attempt to design variants capable of responding to all circumstances, if all circumstances can't be predicted from currently collected data.
Some circumstances (see: Chaos; Slaad, Demons, Eladrin) can not yet be predicted; Theirfore, it is illogical to limit future development.
In the original thread I suggested that the variants could develop in phases. This could allow for temporary limits with the possibility for further expansion in the future. Remember, also, that while Specialization might be a trait of Law, Flexibility is not. We should be careful about giving the base castes too many forms and the ability to easily change between them.
I definitely agree with you. It's just that I see the one as the true opposite of the other. The better you are at accomplishing one task, the less skilled you are at other tasks, so the specialized Modrons are by default not flexible.
As to changing between forms, again, I agree with you. To the limited degree that I have thought about it, I figured that it would be both time-consuming and inconvenient, perhaps requiring a trip to Regulus or similar, or the intervention of a Decatone. At any rate, you're right, a change in form should not be something that can be done on the fly or by a modron on its own. If the modrons can easily change form, they are no longer specialized, but flexible.
On the subject of limiting the number of possible variants, what kinds of variants do you see the modrons using?
As a DM, I am reluctant to place too hard a limit on the number of modron variants, because that means I have to think of all the different modrons I might want to use in the future right now.
As what might loosely be termed a game developer working in a loose comunity others like me, I am doubly wary of putting any limit on the number of variants, because I might be curtailing other people's great ideas.
Umm...
So then...
Does anyone have any ideas for varients?
10 people voted for them in that poll, some of you must have an idea about what you wanted to see. Number of varients, the CR of varients, the kinds of varients that get produced (i.e. environment specific, task specific, role specific), etc. can be hammered out once we see what we've got to work with.
But we need something to work with first.
Apparently I sacred everyone else off, so the first thing I should do is say I'm sorry. I've been reading over my last few posts and I was getting downright hostile.
The information on the existing castes is taken from the planewalker article on Modrons.
Monodrone (Single Function Laborers) it can carry out only one
command at a time
Winged Messenger
Tiny Scout
Duodrone (Bi Function Labor) interpreting and carrying out two
commands at once,given only one task at a time,
which allows it the limited ability to react
Battlefield Preparation (Traps and such)
Tridrone (Tri Functional Laborers) Typically, it receives a general
order, then divides the objective into smaller
tasks that can be completed by duodrones.
Tridrones are capable of reporting actions and
observations, as well as actually planning limited
objectives on the battlefield.
Alchemist
Quadrone (Managers )report actions and observations, make
plans, react to unexpected occurrences, and act to
remedy them
Arboreal combat
Winged
Aquatic
Pentadrone (Police Forces) communicate, operate, monitor,
plan, and manage.
Formian Killer
Demon Killer
Eladrin Killer
Slaad Killer
Negotiator
Hexadrone (Scientist) Observe and formulate general
laws to predict future observations.
Heptadrone (Elite Soldiers, Swat Team)
Octadrone (Base Matanance)
[gate mode]
[converts lower modrons between varients]
Enneadrone (Transport and Logistics) Psionic
Decandrone (Arcanists and Generals) Wizardry
Hendrone (Coordinator, Inquisition, Strategist)
Very little is known
about this cast. Even in circles where detailed knowledge
about the upper Modron castes is common, most people
believe that the castes progress from Decandrone to
Decaton. The Hendrones are a transition caste between
the heirarchs and the base castes. They are extreamly
telepathic and largely nonmotile. When a Decaton gives
orders to a Decandrone, it often appears that the 'ton is
giving instructions directly to the 'done. In fact, their is a
Hendrone focused on the conversation, relaying the
instructions in real time.
Decaton (Caretakers of the Base modrons)
Nonaton (Chief Inspectors)
Octon (The Governers of Regulus)
Septaton (QA)
Hexton (The Master Generals)
Quinton (The Librarians)
Quarton (The Administrators)
Tertain (The Justices)
Secundus (The Seconds of Primus, viceroys of the quarters)
Primus
The Hendrone should really be called Hendecandrone, but I thought that was too long and also unnecessary.
Edit: I'll do one better than stars, the entries for new modrons are now cyan.
The one line descriptions for the roles of the 'tons are also new, I believe, so take them with a grain of salt.
Also, I said I wasn't going to add new castes, and I'm not really planning on it. I'm hoping to work up stats for the higher 'drones both as modron castes and non-modron construct/outsiders. Under this scheme, the Pentadrone would remain the highest of the 'drone castes.
Edit: Swapped the roles of these two castes above.
Heptadrone (Base Matanance)
[gate mode]
[converts lower modrons between varients]
Octadrone (Elite Soldiers, Swat Team, Military Comandants)
Any chance for starring (*) the new ones? It's quite a list, and it boggles my simple mind. 
Check (and bump).
Also, is the general pattern of varients on a caste.
But mostly just posting so you know I've changed it.
I like the idea of the new castes (hexadrone, heptadrone, octadrone, enneadrone, decandrone, and hendrone). With pentadrones have a CR of 8 and the previous pattern of advancement in power, even if the the increase in power translate into increase in CR at a decreased rate, some of these new castes will get into the CR 16-20 range. This is fine. But it will necessitate that all of the hierarches are epic. Since many people at this forum seem to dislike "epic levels" this will need to be defended. I'll start; the hierarches are essentially static features of Mechanus, and should not be considered monsters to be slain, but rather beings to be dealt with respectfully on their terms, even for extremely high levels. They still require stats so that their capabilities are clearly detailed.
Has anyone else here seen the project being done at Dicefreaks on Mechanus title the The Infinite Cogs? [url]http://www.dicefreaks.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5382 [/url]
Ya, we had that discussion in the Brainstorming session, part 5: Miscellaneous and [Poll] Modron Module (Brainstorming session, part 5: Miscellaneous) threads. I wanted the Decandrone to clock in at around CR 20. According the the poll in that second one, I lost by a convincing margin (2-10 new castes vs. caste varients, 2-3 new castes vs. allies). However, since I seem to be doing most of this, and because I'm stubborn, I'm going to do it my way first and then convert the new castes into construct/outsiders of similar CR (Out-voted me 5 to one, huh? Well, ok, you win. We'll do both).
I like writing stats. Pity my players.
Would you mind laying out your intended CRs?
Urg...P-Chem final.
Anywho, I think you got it: 1/2->20, jump of 2 CRs per caste.
Mono 1/2
Duo 2
Tri 4
Quad 6
Penta 8
Hexa 10
Hepta 12
Octa 14
Ennea 16
Decan 18
Hen 20
Varrient CR should vary as I mentioned above, stuff like the Formian Killer Pentadrone varrient might be tricky to CR, they'll be more dangerous if you're vulnarable to the same things Formians are, and less dangerous if not. But then, that's the case for any monster: if you're not vulnarable to its attacks, it's not as dangerous.
I'm not as interested in the heirarchs, to tell the truth, as they're something that's really campain-dependent. They should be balanced against the power of the other unique beings in the campain. So if you're in the (...uhh, demon book, recent release, marlilith on cover...) ballpark for archfiend status, then what they've got right now works(10-20). Tyrants of the Nine hells, maybe 18-25. Dicefreaks, big spread, 25-40 or 50, I would think. In most campains, I don't think their stats matter too much, they're big, out their, and unlikely to be encountered in combat.
The problem I have with the current order of things is that you lose the ability to have Modron encounters at about 6 above the Pentadrone's CR, 'cause 16 is just too many creatures to run to get an equal EL encounter. Any hierarch has so many base modrons at its command that expecting to attack one and live is foolish in the extream, especially at level 10 (Decaton's CR).
*Checks Dicefreaks* Oh, unless you ARE dicefreaks, in which case the Modrons aren't as important as they are in planescape.
Is epic something you have fun with? If so, you could work up a number of different epic varrients for the Hierarchs.
Modron Subtype
•Darkvision 60ft
•Immune to mind effecting effects, critical hits, nonleathal damage, ability damage, ability drain, fatigue, exhaustion, and energy drain
•Energy Resistance: acid, cold, and fire
•Energy Immunity: electricity
•All attacks count as Lawful aligned
•Mental Scores = to HD + Bonus
oBonus = 1-2HD +3, 3-6HD +6, 7-14HD +9, 15-30HD +12
o≥31HD Mental scores = 46+1 per 4HD over 31
•Physical Scores = to 10+Heirarchy level
•Always receives max HP for first HD
•DR=HD
•Natural Armor = HD
•SR=10+HD
The subtype I'm using for the modrons. Note that the modrons, orderly little fellows that they are, have almost all their stats determined by their subtype.
Modron Outcasts no longer have this subtype.
Is this resistance 10?
It varries, increasing as you climb the castes. Mono- thru Tridrones have ER 5, Qua- and Pentadrones have 10, Hexa- thru Octadrones have 15, Ennea- and Decandrones have 20, and Hendrones and, presumably, Decatons and Nonatons have ER 25. This scaling should keep the ER a factor at all levels without shutting down low level spells against low caste targets.
Also, a Modron caste's CR is one less than its HD.
Edit: And also, a Modron recieves a masterwork bonus on its attacks equal to half its hierarchy level, rounded down.
This is all stuff I figured out after posting that subtype.
Further Edit: And also, the damage reduction is overcome by Chaos, Entropium, or Karach. Mono- thru Quadrones are also vulnarable to magic weapons, and it changes to Chaos and Entropium or Chaos and Karach for Octadrone up. Presumably Epic gets thrown in somewhere in the first few heirarch castes.
Yet more: Modrons are proficient with all weapons listed in their entries and the entries of lower caste modrons. Weapons do not upgrade when a modron promotes, so a Quadrone promoted from a Tridrone mid-battle will still be armed with the Tridrone's three short swords rather than a Quadrone's four long swords.
Hello everyone. This is my first time posting on the boards, so I apologize if somebody else already thought of this and I missed it. To continue the idea of modron evolution, I agree that any testing would probably be done in Mechanus under controlled conditions.
But how would the process work? What if the PCs happened upon/were thrown into a simulation facility, cable of reproducing a variety of environments and situations? Modrons of a particular caste, who were being considered for new variations or specializations, could be placed in this area. Since their consciousness can be represented by a series of predicates and responses (or at least bloody close to it), something like a genetic algorithm might be used to find the optimal mental configuration for a new modron type. A given ‘run’ would proceed until some subset of the population was eliminated, either through destruction (in combat models) or some criterion of failure. The rulesets governing the remaining modrons could then be combined in a variety of ways and downloaded into new physical bodies if need be. The simulation is then restarted, the most ‘fit’ consciousnesses survive/succeed, and the process repeats. In several generations an optimal solution would be found.
The PCs might serve as random factors that break or derail the evolutionary process, resulting in bizarre or sub-optimal modrons for a particular specialty. Perhaps the environment itself would begin acting against them, if whatever modrons controlling the simulator detected their presence and judged it more detrimental than tainting one experiment’s data. Or, the PCs could be sent by an agency like the Guvnors or other allied groups to act agents of ‘natural’ selection in the creation of combat models. Each iteration would create better war machines, until the optimal mental construct for a particular physical caste variation was reached. In game terms, their CRs would get progressively higher and the DM could employ cleverer tactics.
Added 'Negotiator' Pentadrone to the list. I suddenly have this mental image of a squad of PCs wandering through a mock-up marketplace, staring bemusedly at dozens of Pentadrones bussilly haggling with shopkeeps, innkeeps, touts, and in rare, unfortunate cases, walls and dustbins. Every once in a while an altercation breaks out as a Pentadrone decides that violence is the most direct solution to a particularly irksome merchant.
Heh. I love that. I know that solution has come up a few times in adventures I've run. . .
The entire idea of the modron variant testing ground reminds me somewhat of the Rubikon dungeon generator from PS:T. I could even see it being retconned into cannon as a tester for the more combat oriented varients.
I think we should double the Monodrone's CR as well. I also think that the varients should have the exact same CR as the base form. Other than that this looks good.
The number of variants each caste should have should follow a mathematical progression. My suggestions include the Fibbinacci (sp?) sequence, n, 2^(n-1), and n^2 where n = caste rank (eg. Monodrone = 1).