How did Orcus become reborn?

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Chrysalis's picture
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How did Orcus become reborn?

I recently read Dead Gods and have been bothered that in Fiendish Codex I it is mentioned that Orcus has taken over his old layer again and has his wand.

What happened to Orcus between Dead Gods and The Fiendish Codex I?

The reason I am asking is that my character in a game I am I have this in her background:

Quote:
...And so it came to pass that these words spoke in wrath dispersed to all corners of the land, proclaiming their message and blasting all minds that heard it. Neighbour turned on neighbour and in sudden fury fathers dragged sons onto the street and there murdered them. The gentle beasts of the field trampled one another and herdsmen slew their cattle to bathe in their blood. The kings and princes of the land fell to fevered imaginings, adorning themselves with armour and weapons, and demanding a throne made from the bones of their kin. Prisoners and slaves were put to the sword and their heads adorned the royal dais. And the kings then sent their soldiers forth into the towns and villages to harvest more skulls for the skull thrones. Every living thing they killed; all that drew breath was culled from the earth, which in turn was fired and the walls tumbled down, so nothing could there live again. When the earth was made as mud by the lifeblood of innocents and wild creatures roamed the deserted lands drinking marrow from the bones of the dead, the kings and princes turned their armies outside their hollow kingdoms to wage war against each other. The armies of all the lands met in a valley blocked by four mountains to the north and four mountains to the south. And there they fell on one another with every weapon, animal and cunning machine that they commanded. The battle raged long as fortune waxed and waned from one army to the next. For eight days and seven nights the warriors of the lands pushed and heaved and stabbed and slew. The kings released their hunting dogs, that harried and bit and gorged themselves on hot flesh. Terrible horsemen, on steeds clad in steel, charged again and again. The death toll was so great that the valley itself filled with blood and drowned those who fought in its depths. The soldiers in battle hungered, and consumed the fallen and drank their blood to quench their thirst, while the kings themselves ate only the flesh from the heads brought to them. As the sun sunk down into the lake of death for the eighth time the battle faltered and stopped, for the bloodthirst that had driven each mortal soul forward had at last been sated. What was left of the armies could fight no more and there came a great wailing from the valley as those few soldiers who could lifted their voice and cried out for release, for victory or for the strength to carry on. A multitude of raised shouts to a thousand empty gods. And none replied. For the true god had heard his servants' cry. And its answer was of bloodlust, power and awesome violence.

From the boiling blood sea rose eight mighty creatures, each with the heads of dogs and the bodies of lions, and each one yoked with great chains of brass. They climbed forth each mountain and behind them dragged upwards a new mountain from the sea, a mountain of bone and skulls that reached fully ten times the height of the eight peaks around it. Upon its sight, the few surviving soldiers of the battle took new heart and rose again from the gore-drenched earth to praise their true lord while the kings and princes threw themselves down on their swords in fear as they recognised the true Skull Throne, of which their own had been the palest imitation. And atop the very summit, the rebirthed-god screamed his name in a birth-cry that echoed and crashed from peak to peak and drove the cowardly near.dead to death even as it strengthened the worthy beyond mortality.

And the name was Tenebrous, our Blood God Orcus.

And I was wondering if it contradicts something already written?

Bob the Efreet's picture
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How did Orcus become reborn?

'Chrysalis' wrote:
I recently read Dead Gods and have been bothered that in Fiendish Codex I it is mentioned that Orcus has taken over his old layer again and has his wand.

What happened to Orcus between Dead Gods and The Fiendish Codex I?

I believe the assumption is that Quah-Namog succeeded in his resurrection of Orcus. Or somebody else did a similar thing after Q was thwarted by the PCs. Really, Orcus is too cool to leave dead. And Monte Cook, who wrote Dead Gods and BoVD (where Orcus was first reintroduced), apparently feels the same way.

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420
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How did Orcus become reborn?

There is a bit about this in the Manual of the Planes (pg. 103):

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It is not clear how, or why, but the truth can no longer be denied. Orcus is back. With a vengence.

Was the demon lord really ever dead? Probably, which accounts for his long absence, and explains his recent incarnation as a power of undeath calling himself Tenebrous. As Tenebrous, Orcus was able to slay even deities, wielding an ancient power known as the Last Word. He bullied some, and slew others who stood in his way. Orcus revitalized his wand, and with its strength initiated a spell of resurrection cast by one of his last faithful servants, the half-ogre Quah-Namog. Heros from the Material Plane seemingly disrupted this ceremony at the eleventh-hour, but Orcus returned all the same.

Despite the fact that the power of the Last Word is dissipated, Orcus is a cruel, heartless, and powerful demon lord in his own right. Naratyr, and the Abyssal layer of Thanatos on which it resides, is rightfully his, and he will have it no matter what. Let his enemies despair.

EDIT: Here is an interesting bit of detail from the Book of Vile Darkness (pg. 138)

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Not only is Quah-Nomag a despicable creature in virtually every way, but he was instrumental in restoring Orcus back to the living. The evil cleric used an obscene ritual on the Astral Plane that restored Orcus.

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How did Orcus become reborn?

I'm kind of disappointed that a God-slaughtering undead demon prince that brought the multiverse to its knees and changed numerous previously unquestionable aspects thereof is simply reborn and goes back to his humdrum life of ruling the undead of a single Abyssal layer and squabbling with the two headed baboon snake suffering from multiple personality disorder and the horny (in more ways than one) black dude with polydactyly.

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How did Orcus become reborn?

'Iavas' wrote:
I'm kind of disappointed that a God-slaughtering undead demon prince that brought the multiverse to its knees and changed numerous previously unquestionable aspects thereof is simply reborn and goes back to his humdrum life of ruling the undead of a single Abyssal layer and squabbling with the two headed baboon snake suffering from multiple personality disorder and the horny (in more ways than one) black dude with polydactyly.
I was never disappointed with that, maybe because I knew that Orcus coming back was always what Monte Cook intended, quite possibly from a post he made to the old mailing list a long time ago. Besides whether the PCs succeeded or not against Quah-Namog's plot the body of Orcus disappeared at the end of the adventure anyways, showing that he wasn't dead anymore.

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How did Orcus become reborn?

'Kobold Avenger' wrote:
'Iavas' wrote:
I'm kind of disappointed that a God-slaughtering undead demon prince that brought the multiverse to its knees and changed numerous previously unquestionable aspects thereof is simply reborn and goes back to his humdrum life of ruling the undead of a single Abyssal layer and squabbling with the two headed baboon snake suffering from multiple personality disorder and the horny (in more ways than one) black dude with polydactyly.
I was never disappointed with that, maybe because I knew that Orcus coming back was always what Monte Cook intended, quite possibly from a post he made to the old mailing list a long time ago. Besides whether the PCs succeeded or not against Quah-Namog's plot the body of Orcus disappeared at the end of the adventure anyways, showing that he wasn't dead anymore.

You misunderstood me. I was not suggesting that bringing Orcus back was a poor idea. I was saying that his resuming his comparatively dull duty as a Tanar'ri lord seems rather anticlimactic.

Imagine having goblin_01 getting offed by orc_02 and then, say through some errant spell or something, coming back as a powerful ghost that destroys not only orc_02, but also the king of the nearby human castle and a few dragons for good measure. Then, just as he's about to be ressurrected, a PC party attempts but fails to destroy him for good, and the ressurrection goes through as planned. Would it, after such an epic campaign, be cool if he went back to being a lvl 1 goblin_01 guard posted at the goblin warrens? I don't think so. Orcus' situtation is just the same but at a cosmic level.

420
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How did Orcus become reborn?

'Iavas' wrote:

You misunderstood me. I was not suggesting that bringing Orcus back was a poor idea. I was saying that his resuming his comparatively dull duty as a Tanar'ri lord seems rather anticlimactic.


He didn't quite resume his old way of "life":

BoVD (pg. 137)

Quote:

Orcus is no longer content to grow old and fat feeding on larvae in his castle. He focuses his anger and hate on the absolute destruction of his enemies and the spread of woe and havoc among mortals. Truly a demon reborn, Orcus is more terrible and more dangerous than ever.

...

Probably because he has an identifiable, if loathsome, "portfolio", Orcus is worshiped as a god more often than most of the other demon princes are. Although Demogorgon mighty actually be more powerful, Orcus may be closer to ascending to true godhood.

-420

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How did Orcus become reborn?

For him to be a dead god in the Astral, means he had already been a god. I fail to see after being a god and retaining his power base he goes back to being your regular quasigod that is stuck on his own layer. Especially if he could be a god once more that is not limited by the Blood War or the internal squabbling among the rest of the quasigods on the infinite layers of the Abyss.

I have to agree him going back to his old layer and knitting socks seems far too humdrum for a god that has died twice and been revivified twice.

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How did Orcus become reborn?

'420' wrote:
BoVD (pg. 137)
Quote:
Orcus is no longer content to grow old and fat feeding on larvae in his castle. He focuses his anger and hate on the absolute destruction of his enemies and the spread of woe and havoc among mortals. Truly a demon reborn, Orcus is more terrible and more dangerous than ever.

...

Probably because he has an identifiable, if loathsome, "portfolio", Orcus is worshiped as a god more often than most of the other demon princes are. Although Demogorgon mighty actually be more powerful, Orcus may be closer to ascending to true godhood.

-420

Okay, so goblin_01 is now a lvl 1 fighter as well. Whoopteedoo. Yeah, Orcus is no longer happy to be a fat lazy pig. Now he's a fat pugnacious pig. Still not very fun. I agree with Chrysalis - once you've been a god twice reborn, retaining godhood is the least step that you could take to even stay at the same level.

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How did Orcus become reborn?

To be fair I think Orcus is listed as a god in Libris Mortis (not WoTC's finest hour but canon nontheless).

However from a game-designer/DM perspective it makes more sense to have him as an 'almost god' - lots of opportunities for adventures as he attempts to step up again.

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