final crisis: fighting gods?

8 posts / 0 new
Last post
sciborg2's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2005-07-26
final crisis: fighting gods?

I don't know if you peoples read the funny papers, but Grant Morrison's Final Crisis is imo really shaping up around a question that resonates with PS:

How do you fight gods?

These gods can fire weapons through time, make slaves using the Anti-Life Equation (think Last Word but negating Freedom instead of Life), but that isn't the worst of it. The gods are not simply supervillains, but rather manifestations of the darker emotions within mankind. Though similar to the planar lords, they can reach into reality so that a calculating person channels Athena and one filled with murderous anger channels Ares.

It reminds me of Quethel's fight with the Evil "elemental" in Book I of SpiderQueen War (the only good one in the series really) where as horrible as the drow are the raw essence of Chaotic Evil traveling on the thought-plane cracks their minds open. How do fight something that IS anger, or even IS love?

__________________

Health Resources: Register family with 911 services, so providers will have info prior to emergency/disaster. Also mental health info & hotlines, articles, treatment assistance options, prescription assistance, special needs registries, legal aid, and more!

Githyankee's picture
Offline
Namer
Joined: 2006-12-06
final crisis: fighting gods?

Somewhere out there, is a sword for just that occasion.

ripvanwormer's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2004-10-05
final crisis: fighting gods?

A blade of innocence?

sciborg2's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2005-07-26
final crisis: fighting gods?

as arrogant as it sounds, i was thinking the same thing....what is this blade
of which you speak sirrah?

__________________

Health Resources: Register family with 911 services, so providers will have info prior to emergency/disaster. Also mental health info & hotlines, articles, treatment assistance options, prescription assistance, special needs registries, legal aid, and more!

Kobold Avenger's picture
Offline
factotums
Joined: 2005-11-18
final crisis: fighting gods?

I don't know about the rest of you, but I want to try explaining a dream about being exiled to Earth after being judged by a bunch of beings.

sciborg2's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2005-07-26
final crisis: fighting gods?

at least you'd get free burgers K.A. in 'prison'....muses about Carceri...but that's another topic...

the way i was thinking about it last night was how do you know when you are falling in/out of love? what if a god moves through like love moves through you. that, to me, is what morrison talks about -- a way really touching on the Greek idea of theos:

to have great emotions, monstrous emotions, is to be possessed by a god - Achilles and Agememnon touch upon this in the Iliad.

but can gods be sneakier than that?

let's say nerull is manifesting himself in a world where he is the first god to show up. we'd likely have a better, more plausible reason for The Happening but that'd be the only thing good about it. how can we trust our 'negative' emotions - and how do we fight such intrusion? can we, as humans, make Nerull more human and thus more fallible (like how Changelings in C:The Lost can become too human)? Is the key to detecting intrusion enlightenment or carving out excess emotions - but then are we merely ripe for harvest when Pholtus shows up?

__________________

Health Resources: Register family with 911 services, so providers will have info prior to emergency/disaster. Also mental health info & hotlines, articles, treatment assistance options, prescription assistance, special needs registries, legal aid, and more!

sciborg2's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2005-07-26
final crisis: fighting gods?

Grant Morrison:

"When we decided to do a book about gods, we felt it was important to do think through what a ‘god’ actually is. Gods aren’t like souls, or ghosts, gods are much bigger and scarier than that.

You know, it’s like every single word culture developed is own pantheon of Gods -which unsurprisingly all share similar traits, like the Greek goddess of Love is Aphrodite, while the Voudon goddess of Love is Erezulie and the Norse goddess of Love is Freya and so on. Now, what you have to understand is this: our primitive forebears weren’t stupid and when they talked about gods what they were describing were ‘eternal qualities’. In a normal human lifetime, we become possessed by ‘gods‘ every day. When we fall in Love, we are possessed by Aphrodite, when we are witty and clever we are possessed by Hermes or Thoth, when angry we‘re possessed by Ogun or Tyr or Ares. We tend to call such possessions ’moods’. but even when we are not personally in love or angry, there is always Love and Anger in the world and those eternal wells of Love and Anger and the other ‘big’ qualities of the human emotional spectrum are what our ancestors personified and called ‘gods’. The ‘god’ in this case, being the timeless quality of ‘Love’ or ‘Anger’ that we can all tap into for a little while.

No-one was really ever suggesting that there is a real woman you can touch called Aphrodite, who lives on Mount Olympus - but the sum total of every single human experience of Love is what the Greeks called Aphrodite and the Celts called Brigit and so on. I hope that makes sense.

In the case of Darkseid and his diabolical court, we’re dealing with personifications of absolute negative qualities. We’ve all been possessed by Greed or Hatred in our lives but Darkseid and his pals are embodiments of the timeless qualities of Tyrannical Will or Sadism or Envy or whatever. So in the sense that we can be cruel, or ignorant, or hate people we’ve never met, we all have Darkseid or Desaad within us. It’s like the idea of being possessed by the Holy Spirit, except in this case they are Unholy Spirits and the Gods of Apokolips want us to replace all our good qualities with all our bad qualities so that we become vehicles for their evil intentions.

There’s always Greed in the world. There’s always Fear. And a lot of this ties into what Geoff’s doing in Green Lantern with the idea of the emotional spectrum. We’re creating a big mythology for the DC Universe and Final Crisis is intended to be a myth for the 21st century."

__________________

Health Resources: Register family with 911 services, so providers will have info prior to emergency/disaster. Also mental health info & hotlines, articles, treatment assistance options, prescription assistance, special needs registries, legal aid, and more!

sciborg2's picture
Offline
Factol
Joined: 2005-07-26
I'm trying to think of way

I'm trying to think of way to tie-in what's happening here with Planescape stuff. Here are some ideas I've gotten from it:

1. Bullet through time - gods can play with time-space, and send a weapon from the future into the past.

2. The Antilife Equation - a formula/spell/glyph/ that takes away all free will. The god of freedom is immune. And apparently you can disseminate it via the internet.

3. The Spectre - God's spirit of vengeance. The Spectre actually might be a good addition to a planar campaign as a force of vengeance that predates the gods.

4. The New Gods as a pantheon? Will have to think more and give some kind of explanation on who these guys are at some point...

__________________

Health Resources: Register family with 911 services, so providers will have info prior to emergency/disaster. Also mental health info & hotlines, articles, treatment assistance options, prescription assistance, special needs registries, legal aid, and more!

Planescape, Dungeons & Dragons, their logos, Wizards of the Coast, and the Wizards of the Coast logo are ©2008, Wizards of the Coast, a subsidiary of Hasbro Inc. and used with permission.