Far Realm Ecology

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Anwald's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

Could islands of sanity exist in the Far Realm, perhaps demiplanes? That is to say, is it conceivable for demiplanes to sustain normal life and beings in the Far Realm (and not tied to any multiverse) and not have a high probability of being destroyed or rendered as inhospitable as the Far Realm? Also, I was wondering if one could adapt the Embryonite from The Guide to the Ethereal to a Far Realm setting. Thus, it creates demiplanes, possibly hospitable ones, as a sort of byproduct of its "life cycle," or whatever analogous behavior Far Realm entities might have. Finally, assuming demiplanes could exist with some sense of stability in the Far Realm, could they connect with each other to form communities of demiplanes and possibly systems of demiplanes? If so, a sort of pseudo-multiverse could result, including complex societies and economics. Or could this even be how multiverses come to be?

P.S. An unrelated question, but could someone elaborate on the concept listed in the encyclopedia about the multiverse being part of the Modron Orrery?

Thanks so much you guys!

Zimrazim's picture
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Factol
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Far Realm Ecology

There's stuff from the Far Realm in this universe. I suppose it's possible that stuff from this universe could end up inside a Far Realm.

It's not usually a good thing for the native inhabitants of either realm, of course.

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2) Roll a natural 1 on d20.
3) ?????
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weishan's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

On the far realm, I'd say probably not, because I treat it as one or several diferent realities then the great wheel. It might be possible to make one for a short time magically, but the same rules of magic probably wouldn't apply. Yes, you could definitely go there and try. It wouldn't work very well, probably, though.

On an entirely different note, adding islands of sanity isn't always a good idea because it takes away the fear and mystery of the Far Realm--which is an entirely diferent multiverse or several or the chaos stuff the great ring was made from--and makes it too mundane. It's like weakening monsters the first time the PCs see them. It ruins the next fight. Overusing the Far Realm is like overusing the Lady and making it hospitible is like making the Lady talk. Not wise, probably.

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factotums
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Far Realm Ecology

The Far Realm is pretty poorly described, at least in the official sources that I've found. Personally, I see it as having the potential to express all possibilities, even those completely unimagined in the multiverse and the real life on which it is loosely based. Physical laws, dimensions, and consciousness exist not only in greater numbers than we are used to, but also in various combinations. Different multiverses, including the one we are most used to, float in this sea of possibility as self-inclosed infinities with a particular combination of traits that its residents consider normal. Obviously, when said residents leave the safety of their bubble and encounter the entirety of potential, or even a greater chunk of it, they are overwhelmed. Likewise, if they encounter a being from a different multiverse with different laws, they will it call it an aberration. What if a creature was born in a world where it could freely travel vertically, laterally, and temporally but was stuck in constant and uncontrollable motion forward? You get my drift - it's not just giant ticks out for brains. What we consider normal is just part of a greater whole that is the Far Realm, and it is certainly possible, within my theory, to encounter bubbles of existence with traits similar to those of the multiverse.

That said, the chances of finding one before succumbing to the madness are miniscule, and I agree with weishan that allowing working spells and areas of normality would simply turn it into a greater Limbo and ruin it.

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Far Realm Ecology

'Anwald' wrote:
Also, I was wondering if one could adapt the Embryonite from The Guide to the Ethereal to a Far Realm setting. Thus, it creates demiplanes, possibly hospitable ones, as a sort of byproduct of its "life cycle," or whatever analogous behavior Far Realm entities might have.

That sounds like a workable fix if you want to make the Far Realm easier to adventure in.

Quote:
could they connect with each other to form communities of demiplanes and possibly systems of demiplanes? If so, a sort of pseudo-multiverse could result, including complex societies and economics. Or could this even be how multiverses come to be?

It's conceivable.

Quote:
P.S. An unrelated question, but could someone elaborate on the concept listed in the encyclopedia about the multiverse being part of the Modron Orrery?

The Modron Orrery is a working model of the multiverse that turns and shifts just as the real planes do. It's so accurate that it can be used to scry locations on the real planes. It can also be used as a portal to transport people to the area being scried.

Zimrazim's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

'weishan' wrote:
On an entirely different note, adding islands of sanity isn't always a good idea because it takes away the fear and mystery of the Far Realm--which is an entirely diferent multiverse or several or the chaos stuff the great ring was made from--and makes it too mundane. It's like weakening monsters the first time the PCs see them. It ruins the next fight. Overusing the Far Realm is like overusing the Lady and making it hospitible is like making the Lady talk. Not wise, probably.

Eh, I wouldn't be a fan of 'islands of sanity' in the Far Realm (like the relatively 'safe' towns in parts of the Lower Planes, which you would never have seen in 1e D&D). It makes some sense that individual people/critters would end up trapped there occasionally. I wonder if an incursion of stuff from our multiverse into a Far Realm would cause as much chaos as the other way around?

__________________

BoGr Guide to Missile Combat:
1) Equip a bow or crossbow.
2) Roll a natural 1 on d20.
3) ?????
4) Profit!

weishan's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

I'd say so. It makes it more interesting that way.

Zimrazim's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

As an aside, I always liked the Far Realm theory about where illithids come from, rather than 'invaders from the future' as they are in Lords of Madness.

Perhaps that they originally came from one of the more 'nearby' Far Realms (in a very different physical form), perhaps a Far Realm that was destroyed, and managed to adapt to the inhospitable conditions of this universe (becoming modern illithids). The original species in this case would have been definitively non-humanoid and more protean (probably a lot more like neothelids). By infesting humanoid hosts and eating brains, they manage to survive here and fulfill their alien... nutritional needs.

Besides, it would explain why they're so frickin weird.

__________________

BoGr Guide to Missile Combat:
1) Equip a bow or crossbow.
2) Roll a natural 1 on d20.
3) ?????
4) Profit!

Anwald's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

Thanks, everyone. I appreciate your responses. I see your points about how islands of sanity within the Far Realm would detract from its nature. Is the Far Realm the only "place" outside of any given multiverse? If not, then I suppose the Far Realm demiplane idea won't really be necessary in cosmology. Also, if I may add a tangential question: what do you think of Wizards' constant inclusion of the Evil subtype in Far Realm Outsiders? I was thinking of simply removing the subtype, since the Far Realm isn't evil, but I still find it vexing that Wizards seems to support the idea that the Far Realm is evil. Sorry if I'm incoherent. It must be the effects of that forbidden tome over there...

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Far Realm Ecology

I tend to just ignore the 'evil' alignment. It just doesn't fit conceptually.

Mind you - if you're looking for a way to make the evil alignment 'work' - there's another way: If they're in the planes, they're subject to the belief effect just like anyone else... and certainly everyone who has encountered these beings and survived are easily of the opinion that they are horrifically evil. So it may be a 'definition' imposed upon them from our own realm. (All the more reason not to like 'normal' life forms as I'm sure such an innate modification of your very being isn't comfortable.)

Anwald's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

Thanks! I wasn't originally looking for a way to work it into the game, but I think your idea works really well. I wonder if natives of the multiverse acquire a similar subtype when they enter the Far Realm? Perhaps that's why one goes insane. I do wonder if there are other spaces outside of the multiverse besides the Far Realm, assuming that the multiverse is a "bubble" in the Far Realm, and also if it would be theoretically possible to traverse the Far Realm and enter another multiverse. Perhaps many of the current inhabitants of the Far Realm were originally inhabitants of different multiverses that were modified by the nature of the Far Realm over time. Assuming that Sigil and the World Serpent Inn are also outside of the multiverse proper, how would their metaphysical spaces compare to that of the Far Realm? Finally, how would multiverses come to be in the Far Realm? Is it a function of the nature of the Far Realm, albeit toxic to it (like a human body can produce cancer as the result of a series of mutations), or is it an act, intentional or otherwise, of an entity either within the Far Realm or without? Could Her Serenity have created the multiverse for some purpose but is unable to interact with it meaningfully outside of Sigil? Sorry for asking so many questions, but I find this sort of cosmological speculation unavoidably enticing. Thanks again and happy holidays!

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Evil Far Realm critters

I think a good fix for the problem of "evil" Far Realm beings would be to add some Neutral or even Good ones... that is, Neutral and Good from the perspective of non-Far Realmers... and Lawful and Chaotic ones, too (madness can be Lawful as well as Chaotic!). Yes, they probably shouldn't have given them ANY alignment, but since they DID, adding some variety will help get any from the "all Far Realm beings are EEEEVVILLLL..." syndrome...

Zimrazim's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

Is the sabre-tooth tiger that's trying to eat you evil?

__________________

BoGr Guide to Missile Combat:
1) Equip a bow or crossbow.
2) Roll a natural 1 on d20.
3) ?????
4) Profit!

weishan's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

Far Realm creatures should be beyond any kind of understanding--that includes good or evil, since these ideas would not exist or would exist in some entirely diferent context in annother reality. The Far Realm does not hurt visitors out of spite or hunger. The vistors are hurting themselves and the Far Realm because they are incompatible with the diferent realities and natural laws.

Azure's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

One other thing is, I think that the far realm is really just a border region, preventing 'real' beings from actually coming into contact the 'other reality' beyond. The nature of this 'other reality' is likely as different from the far realm as the far realm is from the normal multiverse.

Anwald's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

I think that's an interesting speculation, Azure. Lords of Madness also insinuated a similar proposition; that there is something beyond the Far Realm that makes the Far Realm itself pale in comparison (vis-a-vis alien incomprehensibility, etc.). Bruce Cordell also insinuated in the following interview that "Outside," the alternate name for the Far Realm in Manual of the Planes, is actually a boundary of the Far Realm, although I was unable to determine whether it was meant that it was the boundary between the multiverse and the Far Realm proper or whether it was a boundary between the Far Realm and Beyond.

http://www.sevendead.com/?page_id=12

Anwald's picture
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Far Realm Ecology

I feel a little silly. After re-reading that interview with Mr. Cordell, it became pretty obvious from one word (i.e. "merely") that he meant that Outside was intermediate between the normal multiverse and the Far Realm proper, although even reaching Outside is as difficult as reaching the Far Realm is otherwise. The Far Realm proper would likely be beyond the ability of most normal multiverse entities to approach. Is this sort of division hinted at in any other sources? Also, what do you think of any sort of conceptual division of the Far Realm?
Thanks everyone, and have a wonderful day!

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