Certain Factions were founded/set up in Sigil AFTER the Great Upheaval???

I made up a large segment of faction history for a game I ran (merged with a timeline that ripvanwormer put together - stuff from his timeline is indicated with a *). I moved the date of the formation of the Incanterium for some reason I can no longer remember though.

This whole thing involves a number of dead factions made up out of whole cloth. I suspect some of this contradicts published material, but maybe someone will find it useful, so I include the brief form here:

-5275H: Skall gathers a group of individuals who will later become the Dustmen.

-4512H: A group of scholars found a society known as the Historians to chronicle Sigil's history. They gain official recognition by the then-Lords of Sigil in -4502H. In -4478H their role is extended to keeping records of all of the deliberations, rulings, and laws made.

-4462H: A group of prime merchants move en-masse to Sigil and set up shops in what will one day be the Market Ward. In -4453H, they form a philosophical organization known as the Traders dedicating to find the true measurable value of things by trading them (not just physical goods - time, life, etc).

-4425H: In response to certain influences and manipulations, a section of the Historians that believes that the faction's original purpose has been corrupted splinters off and forms the Fraternity of Order.

-4292H: The Brotherhood of the Touched, an organization centered around the various planetouched, forms. Their philosophy: true strength in the multiverse comes from being a bit of everything. They begin experimentation with planar infusions.

-4121H: The Brotherhood splinters due to a sect which believes that the Prime Material plane represents the epitome of their goals, already made form. This group becomes known as the Primes.

-3861H: Rilmani influence in Sigil grows and with it comes an organization known as the Balancers, dedicated to their philosophy. This organization will one day become the Transcendent Order.

*-3732H: The Fated and Bleakers originate around this period.

-3412H: The Oratorium, a faction which (at its surface) teaches the finer points of speech and diplomacy forms. In actuality, their philosophy is 'know the right words to say to the right person, and you can rule the multiverse'. They train a number of skillful manipulators who found empires on the Prime or become notable Blood War diplomats.

-3105H: The Masters of War form, with the philosophy that war is the true testing ground of an individual's worth, and begin supporting various mercenary groups and spreading conflicts throughout the planes, though the Blood War comprises a good portion of their activities. They gain a few members from the Traders.

-3100H: The Masters of War build the Armoury in Sigil.

-3093H: The need for weaponry and armor to feed the Masters of War prompts the construction of the Foundry. The workers at the foundry become the precursors of the Forgesmiths faction.

-2977H: The Seekers of Purpose form in response to several abortive attempts at factions. They wish to know the fundamental truth of the multiverse, as a sort of meta-faction, and can only agree that it hasn't been found yet. They will later become a large part of the Indeps.

-2788H: The Incanterium is created by a cabal of powerful mages.

-2417H: The Fated gain semi-official recognition as the tax collectors for the Lords of Sigil.

-2359H: The Communals form in response to harsh taxation of the poor by the Fated. Many of the members were previously of the Oratorium.

-2171H: The Balancers split, one part becoming the Transcendent Order.

-1937H: The Sons of Mercy forms from an offshoot of the Communals.

-1456H: A number of Fated, Masters of War, and Seekers join to create a new faction - the Expansionists.

-1204H: The Masters of War split, one part becoming the predecessors of the Doomguard, the other part becoming the Sodkillers.

-899H: The Beautification League forms.

*-770H: Rillith's Society moves to philosophical concerns,
becoming the Sign of One. The Transcendent Order attempts to destroy
it, but the plan backfires.

*-749H: Athar formed by Dunn and Ciro.

*-744H: Perrine forms a philosophical society, the precursor to
the Believers of the Source.

-732H: The forgesmiths join the Believers en masse, and the Believers take up residence in the Foundry.

*-581H: Sensates form.

*-500H: The Great Upheaval. The Mercykillers form from the Sons
of Mercy and Sodkiller factions. The Doomguard becomes an official
faction (again), and becomes Sigil's official city guard.

*-374H: Knights of Harmony found the Harmonium in Ortho.

I'm not sure that gives >15 factions to pick from around the Great Upheaval (though it depends on whether you want to take it that some of the older factions were still hanging around or not), so there's room for a lot more around that time. The way I explained it away was that in -632H someone discovers a bunch of historical archives detailing long-dead factions and reviving the dead factions becomes a bit of a craze, thus leading up to the havoc of the Great Upheaval.

Good catch on the three dead factions on page 114. Probably the Communals weren't one of them, since their mazing doesn't seem related to any war (just overreaching itself by insisting the Lady of Pain share power with the people). I think the Incanterium might well have been in the thick of the war, making the factions "dance like puppets on a string." The Zactars might have died out during this time too, and probably the Ochlophiles or other Xaositect predecessor group.

But it says on page 60, "The Takers've been around Sigil for a while; there's always been a need for record keepers and tax collectors in the City of Doors." That makes me think the Fated were one of the first factions, formed around the same time as the Fraternity of Order if not earlier. And it says Bigby's College of Academic Arts was converted "many" centuries ago, which makes me think the number is greater than three.

Plus, the Fated were involved in that conflict, so they must have existed before the three factions were wiped out by it. Here's the exact quote:

"About 300 years ago, an Anarchist lit off a spell that killed the factol of the Mercykillers. The spellcaster managed to blame it on the Fated, starting a war that came to involve almost a dozen factions and put an end to three factions altogether."

I think we can eliminate the Fated from the list of factions who could have sprung up after the conflict was over, then.

I'm reluctant, as I said, to draft the Believers of the Source as one of the three newest factions, but perhaps there's no other choice. Of course, meshing that with the idea that they helped bring Bel to power is impossible, since Bel's been in power for over a thousand years - unless they imagined him in power retroactively. But why would Bel acknowledge a retroactive debt?

Perhaps one of the factions was out of power for a time, and managed to reform about 300 years ago?

I think the whole Bel connection is fairly unlikely anyway; the Signers may be an old faction, but they don't seem that old, considering all we know about their history. Exactly how they became involved in Bel's ascension and how they got credit for it is an area ripe for development. Maybe it was a more recent promotion - maybe even the change in focus from him being just one of nine generals (in Hellbound: The Blood War) to the guy in charge of all the Blood War armies (in 3rd edition). It could have just happened in the last year or so. Or, of course, some kind of retroactive modification of the timeline might have happened, but left its agency clear. Maybe a Signer traveled through time.

So I can't entirely rule out the Signers.

As for which old faction might have been out of power and then returned, later on, after a spot reopened, let's explore them:

The Fraternity of Order seems to have had a continuous history in Sigil from its founding until the Faction War. They were the basis of the city's dating system, and the Abyssal research records seem unbroken.

It's hard to imagine the Dustmen being replaced in their duties. As long as Skall was around, the Dustmen stayed a faction, I think.

I can imagine the Bleakers being temporarily replaced by the Communals as the city's main charitable organization. Probably the Bleakers remained in their Gatehouse, but they may have disbanded as a faction after a series of particularly mad and damaged leaders, and been convinced to band back together after the Communals vanished. But the Communals probably weren't one of the factions that died as a result of the Mercykiller-Anarchist war. So we need to continue.

The Harmonium and Xaositects were definitely not around, so it wasn't one of them.

Probably not the Fated. The city didn't stop needing to collect taxes 300 years ago, and the only faction that seems likely to have replaced them in this task is the Communals.

The Athar were actually extremely obscure until the Harmonium came along! If they had left and came back before then, few would have noticed.

The Transcendent Order might have simply left for no apparent reason, on instinct, and instinctively found their way back after a while, conceivably. I can also somewhat believe that the Sign of One lingered in obscurity until the Transcendent Order came along after the Anarchist-Mercykiller war, the conflict between the two factions happening only then. This wouldn't be so unlike the Athar lingering in obscurity until the Harmonium finally arrived. If that's the case, while the Sign of One might be an old faction, their popularity only dates back a few hundred years.

The Doomguard seem to have been busy acting as the city's cops at the time. They might have disappeared earlier, but they were probably well-established by the time the Harmonium came along.

The Free League only barely qualify as a faction, but they need to always be there (while the factions are in power at all) as a place for independents to go.

We know the Mercykillers and Revolutionary League were involved with the war.

I think the Zactars could quite easily have temporarily supplanted the Sign of One! Their philosophies are quite similar. The Zactars (from Dungeon #55) believe the entire multiverse was created for the benefit of a yet-to-be-born One True Being, which is almost suspiciously similar to the Signer concept of the One. It seems like it would be awkward having both groups around at once. So my theory is that for a time most of the Signers defected to the Zactars, and the Zactar Cathedral might even have replaced the Hall of Speakers as the center of Sigil's government before the Zactars became so damaged and disgraced in the war (and their founder, Zactar, was killed or banished) that they fell apart, most of the survivors reforming to become the Sign of One again. It's a theory, anyway.

Is there a list of former Sigil factions like Incanterium?