Brain asplode...where to begin ?

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Dust's picture
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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

Like I said in my introductory post, I'm comming back into gaming and especially into PS. Now, my trouble is that with the advent of WotC now owning DnD and choosing not to port over PS at this time aswell, I don't know where to start. I don't have my old PS source material anymore (cries at the loss), but from what I gather it probably isn't to useful anymore. So where does a Clueless go to revamp his knowledge after 4+ years of addling?

Trying to follow some of the discourse in this wonderful forum has left me spinning trying to connect who to what to where Puzzled . There is tons of material on planewalker, but not sure where to begin. Thanks.

Bob the Efreet's picture
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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

Start with the PSCS (here on Planewalker under 'released products). Where in there to begin depends on what you want to read about first: Races? Factions? New feats? The City of Doors?

In general, though, I think the best chapter to start with would be six: Life in the Multiverse. It gives a good general overview of the sort of thing a planewalker needs to know.

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Shemeska the Marauder's picture
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This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

WotC material: start with the Manual of the Planes. It's watered down Planescape in many ways. They removed all the para and quasielemental planes in the name of simplification. They expanded the plane of shadow in an unexplained inverse of that. They made the Astral overlap every sodding plane (taking over the role of the ethereal). The ethereal in WotC's interpretation has a bunch of ghosts, straddles the prime material, and really has little to justify being a transitive plane, being as how it doesn't go anywhere.

The flavor of PS got stripped out.

The WotC monster manuals have done a decent job of converting monsters, though they've ignored a lot of Planescape material in the process. The yugoloths lost alot in translation, and the gehreleths got renamed demodands (and their origin myth ignored).

WotC's Planar Handbook. This book knoweth no end to the meaning of 'this blows'. They tried to recapture the flavor of Planescape (with faction prestige classes, etc) and failed most miserably. Planescape pastiche. Throw out everything except possibly the sections on Sigil, the City of Brass, and Tunarath. (Sigil, if bland, doesn't contradict much previous material, or Planewalker's stuff. Ignore WotC claiming The Lady is LN) The last 40 odd pages of the book are wasted on what amounts to nifty planar sites where you go, kill the monsters on the associated random encounter chart, and get powerups to justify your PCs' going to the planes to kill stuff. Utterly at odds with what Planescape was, best to ignore it.

Here on Planewalker: In the official releases, we've put out a number of chapters on everything from Sigil (In which I top WotC's Planar Handbook effort by a factor of ten at least), the Factions, Races, etc converted into 3.x stats. Keep in mind that anything of ours is assumed post Faction War.

Dust's picture
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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

Thanks alot for the information. I'm pretty much going to ignore alot of the new WotC stuff, considerring the utter crap they've turned it in to (I got to read throug hsome of the things you mentioned at a friend's house...ugh!). Basically, if I ever start running games again I'll pull from planewalker and the little bit of usefulness that is the new crap. Planescape was never about sodding power ups?! arg!! <insert string of multilingual cursing>

Heh, I started playing Torment again to reintroduce the flavor of Sigil to myself and got a few friends whoe never picked up PS in 2 days to play aswell, needless to say after the end of the day they called me with "We gotta start playing this!" Laughing out loud .

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

"Shemeska the Marauder" wrote:
Here on Planewalker: In the official releases, we've put out a number of chapters on everything from Sigil (In which I top WotC's Planar Handbook effort by a factor of ten at least), the Factions, Races, etc converted into 3.x stats. Keep in mind that anything of ours is assumed post Faction War.

While your new Planescape material is good, I'm afraid I won't be using the Sigil chapter precisely because it takes place after the Faction War. As I've said elsewhere, I don't find the new Sigil with the neutered factions to be nearly as compelling as the original. Nor does it have as much fluff material to support it as the whole Planescape line.

You may want to consider a Sigil chapter written from before the Faction War, for those people who still play old-school. Otherwise the new fandom will continue to be split.

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

"Krypter" wrote:
You may want to consider a Sigil chapter written from before the Faction War, for those people who still play old-school. Otherwise the new fandom will continue to be split.

Why? I can understand that some people really prefer pre-Faction War, and will only play in that environment. But, presumably, anyone who knows enough about Planescape to demand a pre-FW game has access to the old material. Ergo, you have an entire book about the Cage; what's the point in writing another?

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

"Bob the Efreet" wrote:
Why? I can understand that some people really prefer pre-Faction War, and will only play in that environment. But, presumably, anyone who knows enough about Planescape to demand a pre-FW game has access to the old material. Ergo, you have an entire book about the Cage; what's the point in writing another?

To update it to 3.5E and to make it available for free on planewalker. Sure, you can use the old material, but a lot of people don't have access to the old material, don't want to pay for it, or simply would like to see an update that doesn't necessarily destroy the structure of Sigil as presented in the original material.

I wouldn't presume that someone who wants to play planescape knows enough to differentiate pre- and post-Faction War and would go buy the Guide to Sigil. Many people don't even know what that means. They simply want to play Planescape, but with 3.5E rules. It's confusing to newcomers to Planescape who have heard of it, maybe even bought a book or two from ebay, to read the PSCS chapter on Sigil and find that everything has been thrown upside down and is now incompatible with the older books.

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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

Quote:
h, I started playing Torment again to reintroduce the flavor of Sigil to myself and got a few friends whoe never picked up PS in 2 days to play aswell, needless to say after the end of the day they called me with "We gotta start playing this!"

hee hee hee

aint it the truth. I'm current having one of my new players play torment so he can play as something other than a clueless prime. Because while torment doesnt teach you everything, it makes you feel much more comforttable around Sigil. And teaches you some of the basics of surviving Sigil. (rule 1: dont attack the Dabus. EVER.)

I actually use PS:T to scout out new players. If they like the game and think Sigil rocks, you can probably get them to play as a teifling next time you game.

But if they just skip over all the text they can and are always complaining that you cant use swords, its probably time to move on to another possible player.
And if they keep attacking all forms of undead and anything with horns, thats a red flag too.

But you know you have yourself a PS player when they finish Torment and get really depressed because there isnt any more.

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

I thought that the pre-FW vs. post-FW discussions were over...

Anyway, I'd hoped that pw.com would do what SWRPG did. They published three mini-settings in one, the "Rise of Empire" era, the "Rebellion" era, and the "New Jedi Order" era, using the same rules.

The final version of PS3E could be done the same way, letting everyone choose whether to play pre-FW or post-FW.

Dust's picture
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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

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But you know you have yourself a PS player when they finish Torment and get really depressed because there isnt any more.
Tell me about /mourn .

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

"Nemui" wrote:
I thought that the pre-FW vs. post-FW discussions were over...

Anyway, I'd hoped that pw.com would do what SWRPG did. They published three mini-settings in one, the "Rise of Empire" era, the "Rebellion" era, and the "New Jedi Order" era, using the same rules.

The final version of PS3E could be done the same way, letting everyone choose whether to play pre-FW or post-FW.


That isn't a bad idea.

But then, it would only take a little extra effort by the DM to ensure such a game is possible with the current system the way it is anyway Eye-wink.

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Re: This being said by a player new to this all in 3e

"Nemui" wrote:
...I'd hoped that pw.com would do what SWRPG did. They published three mini-settings in one, the "Rise of Empire" era, the "Rebellion" era, and the "New Jedi Order" era, using the same rules. The final version of PS3E could be done the same way, letting everyone choose whether to play pre-FW or post-FW.

That's exactly what I meant. Sure, you can run Planescape without referencing the PSCS here, and I've been running a PS campaign for years now without using anything from PW until recently, but it would be *nice* to have official support for both post and pre-Faction War. Keeps everyone inside the same tent, so to speak. Just something to consider.

Fidrikon's picture
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Brain asplode...where to begin ?

hmmmmmm, maybe there should be 3 catagories of all the PW material.
catagory 1 would be material that is meant to be used in pre faction war.
Catagory 2 would be the neutral zone, probably where most of the material would end up. Things that can be used efficiently in both settings.
And catagory 3 would be Post Faction War.

This way, you merely have to look at the number at the top (or bottom) of the article to tell where it can ( or should) be used. I think that would make it easyer for DMs who are trying to run a pre/post FW campagin, so they dont spend their time looking through articles that are irrelevant to what they are doing anyway.

Or not. Just and idea.

Better then seperating PW into two differant sites.

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