4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

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Kobold Avenger's picture
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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

So Dark Sun has "Themes" for characters which give them an extra Encounter Power at 1st level. The Themes in Dark Sun are things such as Veiled Alliance, Templar, Gladiator, Elemental Priest, and Wilder (as in the 3.5e Psionic Class). Defiling is incidentally an ability that all Arcane characters can get.

I think that some faction abilities could go be used as themes (others can simply be Boons as described in DMG2), similar to this. As I certainly see some faction abilities as an extra encounter ability. Though I'd have to find out more about how DS 4e handles things.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Kobold Avenger wrote:
So Dark Sun has "Themes" for characters which give them an extra Encounter Power at 1st level. The Themes in Dark Sun are things such as Veiled Alliance, Templar, Gladiator, Elemental Priest, and Wilder (as in the 3.5e Psionic Class). Defiling is incidentally an ability that all Arcane characters can get.

I think that some faction abilities could go be used as themes (others can simply be Boons as described in DMG2), similar to this. As I certainly see some faction abilities as an extra encounter ability. Though I'd have to find out more about how DS 4e handles things.

I think of the boons as described in dmg2 is a very good option.
I don't know very well the dark sun themes mechanics to say if it is good. Are they utilities or attacks?

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Re: Wow, that otogi guy copied

Degausser wrote:

Wow, that otogi guy copied WORD FOR WORD my post about the new faction abilities, he even kept the mistakes I made, like saying "sense motive" instead of "Insight."  Now that I remember, I think someone asked for permission to repost my work, but it would have been nice to get some freakin' credit.  Just a line saying "Inspired by Degausser, his thread on wizards is here (link)"

Well, first time that I am aware of that someone stole my work online.  Ho-rah.  Anyway, thanks for clearing that up Catland.

 

 

I did try to contact you several times about the abilities, and while I did publish it without your promition (scummy enough), but I that would put your name down. It turns out that I actually forgot your name, or it wasn't listed anymore, so I either couldn't or didn't (rather pathetic). So, to make this better, we can do one of two things:

I can edit the post to add your name on the article (citing which parts of the article you made), and if you can give me some links, post your other material. Or, I can delete the page, give you back the material, include my material if you want it (except for the Cyclers and Mercenaries, they belong to someone else) as well as any other material I created not already taken by the Planewalker community so that you can post it under your name.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

catland93 wrote:
I don't know very well the dark sun themes mechanics to say if it is good. Are they utilities or attacks?
Well there's character sheets (with errors) of the Dark Sun characters which I think is on the free side of the site. All the characters there have a theme, and an associated encounter attack power. Themes have sort have been described as being the 3rd leg to a character after Race and Class, which sounds a lot like how factions were in 2e.

Of course I could see there being other themes independent of faction and more based on planar origin, such as Limbo shaper or Abyss Spawned or even Hive Born or Undersigilian. But I'd see the idea of "Faction Themes" probably being one of the more prevalent ones across the planes. I don't know the full mechanical implications of themes yet, as they haven't being described yet. But beyond a new encounter power, they have some prereqs (so that Wizards for example can't become Gladiators, but Swordmage might be able) and there's feats and paragon paths that use themes as prereqs and powers that class powers can be substituted with.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Kobold Avenger wrote:
catland93 wrote:
I don't know very well the dark sun themes mechanics to say if it is good. Are they utilities or attacks?
Well there's character sheets (with errors) of the Dark Sun characters which I think is on the free side of the site. All the characters there have a theme, and an associated encounter attack power. Themes have sort have been described as being the 3rd leg to a character after Race and Class, which sounds a lot like how factions were in 2e.

Of course I could see there being other themes independent of faction and more based on planar origin, such as Limbo shaper or Abyss Spawned or even Hive Born or Undersigilian. But I'd see the idea of "Faction Themes" probably being one of the more prevalent ones across the planes. I don't know the full mechanical implications of themes yet, as they haven't being described yet. But beyond a new encounter power, they have some prereqs (so that Wizards for example can't become Gladiators, but Swordmage might be able) and there's feats and paragon paths that use themes as prereqs and powers that class powers can be substituted with.

The "Themes" idea looks very good for planescape factions but until we don' know the full mechanic we can't update the work. I think utility powers are better of attack power for factions.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Then, this is all we know about Themes:
# Rather than a Gladiator (for example) being a Fighter-type - use the theme to make your Fighter, or Swordmage, or Barbarian, etc into a Gladiatorial fighter.
# Get a theme Encounter Power at 1st level.
# Substitute powers for higher levels
# Some restrictions in place to keep characters from under-powering themselves with mis-matched themes that don't fit their Roles.
# Themes are pre-reqs for some feats and paragon paths.
# If you think of your current character as having two legs "Class" and "Race" - a Theme is a "third leg" that gives you new options - without diminishing your character's other purposes.
# Roles are your purpose in combat. Themes are your purpose in the world.
# Gladiator is something of a controller - can sort of backdoor someone into a Martial Controller.
# Themes started as a feat - evolved to be something you get for free in Dark Sun
# Themes MAY make it into 4E General/Core.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Kobold Avenger wrote:
So Dark Sun has "Themes" for characters which give them an extra Encounter Power at 1st level. The Themes in Dark Sun are things such as Veiled Alliance, Templar, Gladiator, Elemental Priest, and Wilder (as in the 3.5e Psionic Class). Defiling is incidentally an ability that all Arcane characters can get.

I think that some faction abilities could go be used as themes (others can simply be Boons as described in DMG2), similar to this. As I certainly see some faction abilities as an extra encounter ability. Though I'd have to find out more about how DS 4e handles things.

Here it is my first attempt to use Factions as Theme.
You can see it in the first topic page: Cipher Theme.pdf
Please feedback for comments and revisions.

Bye

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Wow I didn't realise this site was still going glad it is Laughing out loud. After a long absence I've rekindled my love affair with the Planescape Setting and I'm in the early stages of running a Scape campaign in 4E. Like I'm sure a lot of you do I've always had a fondness for the Factions and they usually play a big part in my games.

Anyhoo Catland I've really liked your work on bringing the Factions back in line with the new edition. I'm pretty dire when it comes to crunch. As Kobold Avengers already mentioned I really like the idea of 'Themes' being a good mechanic for the factions it just seems to be a natural fit in my head.

I know the DS stuff is not quite here yet but I looked over the Cipher and think that this could be the way forward for representing factions in 4E. I'm keen to put them to a play test on my guys and girls.

I've only got a Signer in the current party the rest still stinking of the Prime and thoroughly Clueless. I'm expecting some recruitment drives in the near future.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Completed Athar, Bleakers, Doomguard Themes. All with feats, boons and paragon paths.
Please feedback me before I post the other faction themes for any errata or consideration.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Add Fated and Guvner

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Hello there. Your work is quite remarkable and I think that these faction themes are quite balanced. I'm going to start a Planescape campaign and I need to have some faction material, since they're the theme-center of the campaign. Is this compilation the old one?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/8972149/Planescape-Factions-4e

If it is, I think I'll just use the pdfs, since they look absolutely great. I'll translate them to Spanish and use them for my players.

Thanks again for your outstanding work!

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Skotos wrote:
Hello there. Your work is quite remarkable and I think that these faction themes are quite balanced. I'm going to start a Planescape campaign and I need to have some faction material, since they're the theme-center of the campaign. Is this compilation the old one?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/8972149/Planescape-Factions-4e

If it is, I think I'll just use the pdfs, since they look absolutely great. I'll translate them to Spanish and use them for my players.

Thanks again for your outstanding work!

The Link is very old. It is the first attempt of faction conversion. I have not removed the file.
The final version is here in the first post of this topic. Athar, Bleak Cabal, Doomguard, Fated Fraternity of order are completed but I will post the rest of the factions soon, in the next weeks. All the work is almost complete but under a final "playtested"updated revision.
It will be wounderful to have a spanish version of the work. I will make an italian version when the work is finished. So, I wait for news; see you soon! Bye

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

If you can give me a template so I can edit it, I would be glad to translate it. My players would be very thankful if they don't need me to explain them all the features they can get with the factions they pick. Just a question: the Faction Gifts are a new list of powers or are there aditional benefits that the characters can gain by raising levels?

Thanks and keep up with the good work!

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Factions Gift are Alternative Rewards, a sub-system explained in dungeon master's guide 2 and dark sun campaign setting. The idea is to replace the usual tree of magic items with more thematic elements that directly add to the characters’ capabilities. An Alternative Rewards works the same as a magic item except it don't take up a item slot or require a charachter to hold it, because it's not a physical object. About Factions Gifts, DM must give it as rewards for roleplaying the belief, player gains for having their character act in a way that demonstrates their character‘s
philosophy. In addition some Faction Gifts represent the faction Ranks (namers, factotum, factor). Ex. Each Dustmen namers gain the "Dead Truce", Each Bleakers namers the Manic/Depressive , each namers Doomguard "swordsplay etc... when a doomguard became factotum must gain Entropic mysteries etc... at DM's discreption.

Faction Theme powers instead are added to the list of powers you can choose from as you gain levels. Whenever you reach a level that grants you a power from your class, you can choose a theme power in place of a class power the same level as or lower in level than the class power you would have gained.

Anyway, when i complete the works I mail you the template.

Bye!!!

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I'll slowly look over each Faction theme over the days.

First thing is it could be argued either way whether or not there needs to be another power source called belief. It's justifiable if there's feats or paragon paths that specifically use belief in general, but also they could just justifiably be things like Athar (divine) and Bleakers (psionic). I'm reserving judgment on that since it's kind of uncertain how things are right now.

Anyways the first one I looked over was the Bleakers.

My comments are:
-I think there should be some bonus to defense or saves against daze or dominated conditions, or bonus to will, or psychic damage resistance via a feat or one of their theme powers because I remember Bleakers had something like a bonus against insanity because they were already insane to paraphrase the Factols Manifesto.

-Maybe Incorporate Madness you should get a bonus against the condition when you transfer it yourself. Just to make it more appealing to use.

-The feat Melancholy Step, maybe the teleport distance should be defined to something like 2 squares, since if it's "your speed" that might make it too strong, even if it's only move actions this round.

-Manic Depressive might need to be simplified a bit.

-Overall the powers and paragon paths are balanced.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Also for Bleakers, stay tuned for apparently one of the books on Shadowfell since it supposedly has rules on insanity.

The next one I've looked at is Athar.

-With Athar, while I like the ability to mark many opponents by saying something blasphemous, I feel there's some issues with Religion vs. Passive Insight being used in many of the powers. It's that it's either quite high or quite low the check. Even if I feel it's thematically appropriate that all Athars should have the religion skill.

-Also Blasphemous Condemnation should be to end of next turn.

-Blasphemous Edict, should be an implement attack.

-Banishment, it probably should be an implement attack, and has multiple different things for each failed save. Banishing a creature to it's home plane for more than something measured in rounds, is almost like having a save or die spell, which generally isn't in 4e anymore.

-One that doesn't need a religion check at all is the Heretic's Strike power. You could just have religion as a requirement.

-Flavour-wise, there's more divine classes than clerics in 4e even if they're the most common ones.

-I feel that Heretic's Fury should do more damage, and only affect those affected by Blasphemous Condemnation, otherwise classes like Fighter, Warden and Battlemind would be getting easy bonuses.

-Gift of Free Will needs to be tiered differently with +5 item bonus being in the epic tier.

-Counter-Indoctrination needs to be elaborated on more. Yes I know that writing about skill challenges can be a challenge (pun intended).

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

In regards to Gift of Free Will I think it should get a more varied progression with more steps, rather than just +2 and +5.

For Guvners...

-I don't think any theme should get a secondary role of hybrid. It seems like the tried and true formula is that while full classes can get dual power sources, they don't get hybrid roles. Anyways Guvners are most likely controllers. I know you put a lot of damage on some of their powers, so maybe the damage should be scaled down, and the effects be more on control effects.

-Like for example Shield of Rules, maybe reduce the die to d4 or d6, but have that secondary effect automatically apply.

-Escape Trick Loophole should be to end of next turn with Sustain Standard, and special "you may do this for 2 more rounds"

-Assemble Pattern could probably also be a Xaositect Gift, but it would go under a different name like "I Found This".

-Fast Loophole, I think it needs to be defined that you pay the ritual cost still. Also I think it should probably only apply to a particular ritual or rituals only of a certain level, given that it's a paragon feat. And does it need to be a ritual you've mastered?

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Good Errata. Thanx a lot. Now I will remove the belief keywoard and the hybrid role. For bleakers, being psionic, I should remove encounter attacks for at will attacks and power points.
I will define the Fast loophole feat. Yes It need to be a mastered ritual.
I agree with all except for:
For Bleakers Addled Mind give a bonus against insanity .
Banishment is an implement attack and with 4e essentials there are some similar effects with remove from the game for hours. See the essential assassin if I remember well.
About Heretic's Strike the religion check is only for "next attack target a chosen defense" not for the rest of the effect.
The Gift of Free Will is a save bonus vs fear charme and not a defense bonus. +2 +5 is good and not epic. There's a similar magic item.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Also, some Factions could draw on many power sources. These powers gain the keyword appropriate to the single class. For example, a paladin Merckiller’s powers have the divine keyword, while those of a warlord have the martial keyword.
What do you think of it?

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I'm fine with factions being dual power sources. In fact I'd see Ciphers as most likely being Psionic and Martial.

Anyways on to the Fated...

-Fated would probably be secondary role striker. If we're going with not using Belief as a power source, then they are mostly Martial, there's some argument for a little bit of psionic but I see martial as being the main one.

-Thief of Confidence, should not be an implement power.

-Taker, for those abilities where they get to roll to see if they loose an action point or healing surge, it should probably be once per encounter even if using an action point or or using second wind general is.

-Taker Blow, should be to the end of next turn. But maybe also add "you have combat advantage".

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

The Doomguard while I'm at it.

-Unstoppable Decline is quite beyond the power of all Encounter Attacks. It should probably be something lesser, like not require a healing surge, add that radiant and necrotic damage to the attack, and have that penalty to defenses to the end of next turn, and maybe something else like target grants combat advantage or gains vulnerability to the end of next turn.

-Entropic Acceleration (feat, which maybe it should be renamed since there already is the power), what's the target? Is it the entropic blow target?

-Doom Rewards needs another description

-Sift could be a utility power or a ritual that any Sinker can learn instead, it's kind of a big thing about being a Sinker.

-Entropic Champion, I feel it should get it's own unique power instead of a wizard daily power, something like a high damage large close burst power, with some slight differences depending blade type. And what should be made clear is that having a particular blade means you have the corresponding encounter power.

-It should be noted that the Voidsoul Genasi gets resistance to psychic damage, so you could associate vacuum with psychic damage.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Updated and additions of Indep, Mercykillers and Ciphers.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Even though I find it hard to fit any of the Factions to the Primal Power Source (except for the obvious Verdant Guild Sect) I'm curious what your reasons might be. It's probably a good thing because otherwise there wouldn't be too many linked to Primal Power.

Anyways with the Indeps:
-Insult Philosophers, what are you making the check against?
-Word of Independence, this suffers from being an encounter power which generally has to the "end of next turn" rather than save ends, but it's also a non-weapon non-implement power without a scaling plus either. So it's sort of a moot point when the power won't hit as much.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Kobold Avenger wrote:
Even though I find it hard to fit any of the Factions to the Primal Power Source (except for the obvious Verdant Guild Sect) I'm curious what your reasons might be. It's probably a good thing because otherwise there wouldn't be too many linked to Primal Power.

From my point of view is the best choise because:

1. To use all the power sources.
2. I see their idea of freedom very linked with the primal instincts.
3. The neutral alignement.
4. Wild Races as bariaur, satyrs, wemics, centaurs choose this faction.

We could think to take the same choice for Fated because their ysgardian origin instead of psionic.

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Kobold Avenger wrote:
Anyways with the Indeps: -Insult Philosophers, what are you making the check against? -Word of Independence, this suffers from being an encounter power which generally has to the "end of next turn" rather than save ends, but it's also a non-weapon non-implement power without a scaling plus either. So it's sort of a moot point when the power won't hit as much.

-Insult Philosophers: Oversight. It is vs. the passive insight.
-Word of Independence: Oversight. There is the implement keyword. Ok, 99/100 is so. But there are some exceptions. Anyway I have removed save ends for: dazed until the end of the encounter or until it is hit or missed by an attack. I think it is a better solution.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Add the Revolutionary League Theme.
I have removed the other themes because the 10mb space-limit.
I will post a single file with all the themes within 10mb.
Thanx a lot Kobold for your ideas and for the corredges to my oversights.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Merckillers:
-Even though half the powers here all revolve around Lawbreaker's Doom, it's too powerful of an ability. It's stronger than most of the other faction powers I've seen, and basically can turn a "secondary" role into a primary one, and it lasts for an entire encounter and can be renewed. The Gladiator and Primal Guardian themes which are of the same secondary role, have nothing to match that. And it's even a better mark in a lot of cases from that of other defender classes, being more effective than similar single target marks such as Aegis, Divine Challenge and Battlemind's Demand, and almost being too much like an Avenger's Oath, as it's sort of strikerish with the extra damage and the slow effect that's anytime in the entire encounter.
So I think this down should be toned down quite a lot, and the powers dependant on Lawbreaker's Doom should maybe be more dependant on any mark.
-Unit Tactics might need to be slightly higher than 3rd level for a gift.
-Also Bloody Capture cancels out many offensive abilities of creatures with it's cancelling teleports. A creature under this should still be able to use teleports offensively.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Only for the Mercykiller theme i have expanded the son of mercy paragon path taken from ddi because this stuff looks so good to me.
I agree with you about Lawbreaker's Doom power is too powerful for a 1st level power but not for a 11th level power, then i can tone down for 1st level and improve so at 11th and 21th. (ex. slowed condition at 11th, immobilized at 21th)
About the thing you said that half the powers here all revolve around Lawbreaker's Doom, I think it is a good thing an it does this theme a better theme against the others.
If the powers are more dependant on any mark they are only for defender classes. I don't think it could be a good solution.
Any way, i will take some days to think better about.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

My thoughts on Lawbreaker's Doom, is that Lawbreaker's Doom can remain as a condition with no lingering effects, but the mark only lasts till next turn and the slowed and extra damage only happens for the triggering attack.

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I think of a good solution could be this:
- the mark lasts until the end of the turn as you said.
- all the powers with "targets of your lawbreakers doom" changed with "marked targets" as you said.
-the power improve by level, and with some feats or paragon paths ( I must to think about), you can gain the same or similar effect for paragon and epic levels.
In this way it can't be unbalanced (The ddi SoM's power is a 11 level without no feats that improve it)

PS: I'm very curious about what you think for Cipher Theme because it is a very limit-case on the edge of balance-unbalance theme. I have structured almost completely the theme around the action points and initiative rolls. I like it but I am afraid you couldn't think the same.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I've had some time to look at the Ciphers.

-So just to clarify, all the powers that have the requirement of Your Initiative Being Higher than all non-Ciphers means you can use it any time during the encounter?
-Well this does have a lot of problems of things that can't be used half of the time, because even if you have a really high initiative and took Improved Initiative like all Ciphers should, you still can roll 1's for Initiative. Anyways gaining extra action points easily might unbalance things, you could easily get 3 extra depending on how you started out in initiative.
-Action Without Thought may be fine as the only encounter power to gain extra action points as it has a cost of losing a healing surge, that not everyone wants to spend often. Cipher Strike though on top of Action Without Thought starts to lead to a ridiculous amount of action points gained.
-I think it would be better thematically if Ciphers had more powers that were immediate or opportunity actions.
-Extra Cipher Action should be taken only once.
-For the gifts that don't allow you to delay or ready actions, even though I know that delaying or readying aren't very Cipherish things to do on the surface, they do cut out sometimes very important tactical actions (such as trying to coordinate a flank). And I think in many cases Cipher masters would know when to act instinctively at the right moment, hence being able to ready actions.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Yes, you can use it anytime. I can remove the final part of the description to clarify.

The big amount of action points gained, it's not
casualty but strongly wanted to represent the trance state.
A Master of the Mind/heart/spirit can spend unlimited action points for encounter and gain a bonus to the defenses until the end of the next turn every time it spends an action point. Gain action point is a "mission" for this theme.

I don't understand when you said of the 3 extra instead of action points.
If the action points sub-system is not good, maybe the 50% of this theme should be rewrited except for action without thought and the utilities.

I cannot think extra cipher action is unbalanced:
one feat for a single daily action point. Maybe you could take this feat one for tier, to not generate strange things with the unlimited selection.
If we will remove the powers with the benefit of the action points this feat become very important for ciphers.

About the ready/delay action we can make they lose an healing surge every time.

This theme will be surely a complex work.

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Kobold Avenger's picture
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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

There's a reason that action points are limited in 4e, it's due to certain game theories such as Economy of Actions and not having one player take up way more time than the others effectively outshining the others. It also leads to easily being able to "nova" which is using all your top powers really quickly, since those action points can be used do encounter and daily powers, with effectively 2 actions to do so because there's so many action points. It's a lot like the reason why back in 3e haste was nerfed.

An alternative would be to have certain powers work like the Battlemind's Lightning Rush the one where a move and attack is made as an immediate reaction, standard action can't be used on your turn unless it's augmented, because it's a very in the moment type ability.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Yes, of course. For this I said you first, it was on the edge to balance-unbalance.
The battlemind powers are a good alternative.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Add the Society of Sensations.
Is it all ok about Anarchist theme, Kobold?

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Kobold Avenger's picture
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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I finally took some time to look at the Anarchists.

-Shadow Strike, does the triggering attack have Combat Advantage if you succeed at the bluff check?
-Mental Conditioning, clarify if the attack can be used in the same encounter or not.
-Saboteur, Spell Snare I think it would be easier if it had it's own effect rather than having to reference other powers. Also like Mental Conditioning can it happen in the same encounter?

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

For the Sensates.

-Sense Link, does this allow Line of Effect from that square, or using powers from there? I think it should be clarified.
-Dramatic Story, might be too dramatically powerful, but I haven't really tracked where the stun effects are at which levels.
-Energy Acceptance, is there a reason why it's limited to cold, fire, lightning or thunder? It doesn't have to be all damage types either.
-Aura Reading Gift, what's the difference for the different levels of the ability?
-Death Holds No Mysteries, what exactly can do you with that action point after making a successful death saving throw and not being healed but just stabilized?

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

-Shadow Strike: Yes. When you are considered invisible you gain combat advantage.
-Mental Conditioning : Yes. anytime the trigger has effect.
-Spell Snare: it need to be clarified and maybe rewrited. Anyway, it is an out of combat power. But a single effect is maybe too limiting and for a daily 20th level out of combat power I don't think it is too powerful.
-Sense Link: it need to be clarified.
-Dramatic Story: It might be too powerful without this :"If an ally attacks an affected target, the stunned condition ends immediately". Anyway i think to rewrite this and add something about you must sustain the power, maybe a zone.
-Energy Acceptance: I have thought it was too powerful.
-Aura Reading: oversight, it is a level 4.
-Death Hold No Misteries: oversight, I have changed in "trigger: you roll 20 or more in a death save"

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

In the latest D&D Podcast it was mentioned the first Dual-Role class will be in Heroes of the Feywild. What do you think about some dual-role theme?

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Kobold Avenger's picture
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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I think one of the key things about dual role classes, which supposedly switches roles in an encounter unlike a hybrid character which is both all the time, is that the switching of roles is dependant on class features. Something that themes lack mainly because their influence is on powers rather than features.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Now while these themes were based on the Dark Sun themes which were the only we had to go by until recently. Do you think the newer format for themes, (with only optional utility powers and a feature at 5th and 10th level) fits different factions better?

While I don't know how you can reconcile the balance between the Dark Sun Theme types and the "essentials" themes yet, certainly designing the later is easier to do, as we don't have to try to shoehorn a bunch of attack powers (I'd still leave some optional attack powers in, if they're appropriate) to a faction.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Yes. The new format fits better with the factions.
I could try to make an essential version of the work without feats, gifts and the big number of attack powers.
Maybe I can add epic paths to complete all the work.

THis is an exemple for fated:

Starting Feature
Benefit: You +1 bonus to untrained skill checks and you gain the Thief of Confidence power.
.
Thief of Confidence Fated Attack
Your power blasts an enemy and transfers its confidence to you.
Encounter ✦ Primal
Standard Action Personal
Effect: You may take an at will attack or a basic attack. If you hit the primary target takes a –2
penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn. You gain temporary hit points equal to 5
per tier and a +2 bonus to an attack roll, a skill check, an ability check, or a saving throw before
the end of your next turn. You can use the bonus after determining the result of a roll.

Additional Features
Level 5 Feature
Benefit: Each time you reach a milestone, you regain an healing surge. In addition choose a plane for tier. Roll twice and choose the best result to knowledge and Endurance about this plane.

Level 10 Feature
Benefit: You gain a +2 bonus to death saving throws. In addition if someone try to force you into a magical contract or attempts to divine your future, the creature must succeeded an Arcana check vs. your will +10.

Optional Powers
Level 2 Utility Evocation

Self-Reliance Fated Utility 2
Face it, the only way to survive in the multiverse is by being able to take care of yourself.
You’ve realized that you can never truly depend on anyone else, so you’ve learned to be much
more self-sufficient.
Encounter ✦ Primal
Minor Action Personal
Effect: Choose a skill. You roll two times and choose the best result to the next check using that skill .

Level 6 Utility Evocation

Borrow Style Fated Utility 6
You’ve been able to take care of yourself by adapting various techniques quickly. You may
imitate the styles of others for a short time.
Encounter ✦ Primal, Special
Minor Action Personal
Effect: Until the end of the next turn, you can use the 1st-level at-will attack powers of any ally
within 10squares of you as though you knew that power. You use all your own statistics to
determine the effect of that power.

Level 10 Utility Evocation

Destined For Greatness Fated Utility 10
Even against overwhelming odds, your heroic spirit rises above and endures..
Daily✦ Primal
Free Action Close burst 10
Trigger: You make an attack vs. a single target
Target: You and one enemy in burst
Effect: Roll a d20 twice. You take the best of your roll for the attack roll, and you can force the
enemy to replace its next attack roll with your other roll.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

::raise dead!::

How many folks are using these, and what's your experience so far? I'm just starting a 4e Planescape campaign, and I'm curious what's worked for people.

For now, I plan to use the simpler Benefits/Restrictions list from here -- /081105/4e-planscape-the-factions -- but I'd like to hear what others have tried and had work?

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Haven't used them, but neuronphaser let us know how it goes. Would love to get more 4E crunch (or fluff really) for upcoming issues of our fanzine.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

sciborg2 wrote:
Haven't used them, but neuronphaser let us know how it goes. Would love to get more 4E crunch (or fluff really) for upcoming issues of our fanzine.

Will do. Should be starting in December, and I'll put these into play pretty much right from the start.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

These themes are a great idea. Thanks for all the hard work! Are the current versions posted anywhere? I have not been able to find them all in the thread.

I have been running a 4e campaign for a few months and have a Dustmen, a Cipher, a Sign of One / Fated and a Godsmen. They are just heading toward paragon tier and are delving into their factions more. Any help you can provide is appreciated.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I'm guessing the PDFs from the first post contains the most current updates, don't they?

SirGareth's picture
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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

The pdfs on the first post are great, but I was wondering about the other factions that are not detailed there. I appreciate any info you have.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

Unfortunately, I don't. Coincidentally, my players ended picking up factions covered here, and personally I'm not very good at creating content, what's a shame, I think.

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Re: 4E PLANESCAPE FACTIONS UPDATES

I'll just have to homebrew some stuff. I'll post it if works out.

Should have a Believer of the Source, a Dustman, and a Signer.

I have one Character who is bent on controlling the Multiverse (eventually) through personal prowess, and believes that he is literally creating the reality through the power of his will. He is a Fated/ Signer, but will have his loyalties tested soon.

Has anyone else had a dual-factioned PC before? Usually I say no to this, but I am trying to be more open to ideas.

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